Sheena Lawrick  00:00

I think again, there's just these like, there's these, I should be doing this kind of thing. And it's like, Where's that coming from? Like, if you if you actually tell me where you think this, like this magical person is like, that's making all the rules for your life is telling you that if you don't work out at 6:30am, you're lazy. Like, that's, that's you telling you that like, so let's, let's change that let's let's let's stop that behavior and you're totally right like yeah, imagine somebody yeah working with somebody who's you know 30 years of like not working out in the morning, and then they you know, you're 31 All of a sudden they're supposed to love it like it's, that's probably not gonna happen.

Bridget Moroney  00:36

Welcome to the performance RX podcast where the conversations are about health, nutrition and mindset for anyone who considers themselves an athlete and the most elite competitors to those who are simply seeking to improve their physical performance. We hope the knowledge shared on this show will empower you to reach your athletic potential. Thank you so much for tuning in. Now for today's episode. Hey, everyone, welcome to today's show. I'm your host Bridget Moroney. Today, my guest is my good friend and fellow former crossfit coach Sheena Lawrick. Sheena is a lifelong athlete and a two time Canadian Olympian. Her passion has always been directed towards getting the most out of her body, she's had a series of life changing experiences that range from competing at the highest levels of softball, competitive CrossFit, to becoming a mother for the first time and now expecting her second child. And this has allowed her to learn the value of being able to adapt to the changes that life throws her way, Sheena believes that there is no one right diet and that each person is unique in their nutritional needs. She values the connection and relationship that she creates with each client, and she teaches positivity patients at a trust the process mentality. Hey Sheena how's it going today?

Sheena Lawrick  01:51

Very good. Thank you. Thanks for having me.

Bridget Moroney  01:53

Yeah, thanks so much for being on here. It's, it's awesome to connect with you again. Yeah. So I know, I read your bio in the beginning of the episode and gave a little bit of you know, your background there. But before we get started with today's topic, is there anything that you want to add to that or anything else that you want to tell anyone who's listening about your background? And maybe how you got into coaching, etc?

Sheena Lawrick  02:19

Yeah, sure, um, you know, it might not be that different from from most, most coaches, but kind of started as an athlete. And then once the athlete life was changing, or, you know, over as we want to call it, definitely kind of had a nice, smooth transition into coaching, it was kind of a natural. Yeah, natural transition, but I've always loved it. I think I've been around coaches, and I've been lucky enough to have really good coaches in my life. And so it was something that whether, you know, I just took naturally to it, or I, you know, again, just having it be something that was always there, I just felt like it was a part of who I was, and just wanted to continue doing that. So yeah, from a young age, I just had, my dad was always my coach, which was, which was great. But I was also lucky enough to have really good female coaches, as well, which isn't always that common, I think growing up so yeah, I just kind of wanted to continue that and pass that along to people that I enjoy working with.

Bridget Moroney  03:13

So that's awesome. I love I love the fact that you bring up female coaches too, because I think you know, coaching and especially in the athletic or fitness or health world, and it's very male dominated or it you know, male highlighted, so it's, it's always great to see, you know, women like yourself and other female coaches. kind of step up to the plate, I guess so to speak there. Yeah,

Sheena Lawrick  03:38

yeah. And yeah, encouraging each other. Right. It's, it's really motivating to, to see other people in this space and to Yeah, like just networking and helping lift each other up, I think is huge.

Bridget Moroney  03:48

Yeah, absolutely. I mean, I'm, I'm all about that with, just like you said, supporting empowering other females especially. And I think also just having that little bit of, of empathy there. Like there's, there's certainly and on both sides, you know, by all means, but uh, you know, there's, there's certain things that women, people who identify as female go through, in, especially in the, in the world of fitness and sport that, you know, sometimes it, I feel is, it's beneficial to have someone who can understand who's who's maybe share that experience, or at least can understand a little bit more empathetically where you're where you're coming from.

Sheena Lawrick  04:30

Yeah, I think the first thing that came to mind when you said that was just, you know, especially around like, body image issues, right? Like, you know, I can remember growing up and like I would, I would read magazines and like all you saw on magazines were like fitness and all that were just skinny, you know, women that were toned, and they you know, nobody really had a lot of muscle, you know, and all sudden, like I can remember growing up and like wanting to go to the gym when I was in seventh grade and like, I'd go to the YMCA and I was like the only which was maybe a little bit too young to be on my own in a way. But, you know, I was the only girl in I read, I was the only girl that like, kind of like I like, you know, lifting weights, I wanted to be as strong as the boys and, you know, all of a sudden, and then, you know, again, you can get into some different identity things here but having muscles and like what did that mean as a female and even now, right, like, a lot of the clients I work with that are, you know, especially in the, you know, 40s 50s, sometimes 60s, like still have these, you know, ideas of like, what a woman's body should look like? What does their body look like? What's the difference there? And like, is it okay to have muscle? Or am I going to get too bulky? And all of these words, right, that we've talked about before? But so yeah, it's definitely having that empathy and kind of being able to go through that yourself. And then to help coach people to what their ideal body composition is, I think is super important. Yeah.

Bridget Moroney  05:47

Yeah, it's interesting. I feel like, you know, in general, with a lot of things, we've, we're making progress as a society, as far as like you said, using that language and the whole, like, there's a classic fear of, Oh, am I getting too bulky as a woman? I think, again, I think people are starting to have a little bit more of an open mind, like you said, about, like, what a woman's body would look like or quote unquote, should look like which there in my opinion, there's there is no should it's but uh, but to your point, there's also those, there's those lingering effects of those, those generations? And so yeah, um, yeah, so So getting into the coaching you you focus a lot on? Well, your, your company, your your nutrition, business focuses primarily on on nutrition. And there's definitely speaking of the age we're in, you know, I think there's there's many examples, for better or for worse, of different nutrition programs and different types of coaches out there and companies. And so I guess a good place to start is what's different? Or how are you guys unique? Because it's you and another coach, or you have a partner?

Sheena Lawrick  07:10

Yeah, yeah. So it's a it's a it was actually a former client of mine. So we we met at a gym. And I was I was her fitness coach first, which is super cool. Her name's Gwen Holtan. And she's my Yeah, my business partner. And we've been, I think it's been about four or five years now. And again, I'm losing time here with the last couple years. But yeah, we, yeah. So we started it together, she was actually her idea for she's kind of like she, you know, we had actually worked. So I was her fitness coach. And we had actually worked with the same nutrition coach, it was somebody who had helped, you know, change my life dramatically. And I recommended, she worked with him as well. And then, you know, we kind of both had very similar experiences where it was like, she, she actually left her job in corporate America to become a nutrition coach. He's like, I'm doing this, I'd love to do it with you, you know, what do you think, and it was getting a coaching job, I loved it. I love the idea of kind of having, you know, my own thing being a little bit more flexible with time. Yeah, and just kind of I was ready for that. And so was she and couldn't have asked for a better partner. She's amazing. We work really well, together. We, yeah, just super lucky in that sense. You know, we've gone through our businesses where, you know, our business has changed, where we took on as many clients as we could at the beginning, wanting to help everybody, right? Which spreads you thin really quickly, which is great, right? But then we've we've, you know, over the years have kind of narrowed down and really kind of figured out who do we help best where where's our knowledge kind of best applied what type of person have we found the most, you know, success with and, you know, as a coach yourself, like, that part's hard, right? When you kind of have to when you want to help everybody, everybody's coming to you, but you're like, you know, this, this isn't really my, I hate the word niche, but like, you know, I think you're really good with this coach over here in this company. These are the types of people that I, you know, I found that I've worked best with, and kind of narrowing down that but it's, it is it's super true, right? When you focus on, you know, one thing one or two things that you're really good at the quality of your work improves, right, rather than trying to be, you know, really, really good at everything and helping everyone which is always a nice thought. But so, yeah, and like, you know, we are we call ourselves a nutrition coaching company. Over the years, we've definitely, you know, we like to slip in that we will 100% You know, also be kind of looking into your lifestyle and things like that. So we were very open with people that want to work with us and saying, like, we're, we're very big on relationship based things, you know, because your your habits and things like that are going to affect your choices, which affects your nutrition. And, you know, we're again, very, very quick to tell people like it's not necessarily your food choices, sometimes it is that we're going to, you know, sit here and tell you what to eat and what not to eat, but we want to look at the underlying behaviors of why you're choosing certain foods. Why, you know, choosing certain portions of food Some things like that, and obviously help give them a framework. But it really is more of like a lifestyle coaching thing, which again, kind of sounds cheesy to say, but the best successes we've had, or people that are like this is, again changed my life. It's not just here's your your diet template, and let's go on our way. We don't have the magic numbers. No one does, right? Like no one has those. The magic foods or the magic portions or the magic macros, whatever. So yeah, so we're kind of we're still evolving as a business in that sense, but we're definitely getting a little bit closer to finding our, you know, our kind of, I'll use the word niche, I hate it, but

Bridget Moroney  10:39

I know, I know. Yeah, I going and developing my own coaching business myself there. And yeah, the the word that keeps coming up, always is is niche and things. And again, it's i I'll echo what you just said, you know, I don't particularly care for that word, but I know it has its own, like, specific purpose and reasons. And, and, you know, also, like, when I first started coaching, getting into that, you know, that enthusiastic, say, if I'm gonna help everybody, but it's it, but it really is a lifestyle. And I know, like, some may. It's, I guess, what I what I want to say is lifestyle, like, that's the terminology that that gets used. But it really doesn't. It's, I guess, it's, it's deeper than that really, like, you know, I think I think we put that label on there, just so people understand. Because like you said, it's not just a, a certain food or a certain macro or what, because if that were the case, then there probably wouldn't be a need for coaches, especially coaches like yourself that are that are looking into the the habits and behavior because anyone who picked up whatever, like the, the South Beach Diet Book, they're gonna throw it out there, like would be instantly successful and never have to do everything again, because, but it's, but it's it's not that and it does go back to the lifestyle, the lifestyle. And so yeah, so I guess kind of getting a little bit deeper into your, your niche there, if you will know, so, you mentioned the whole behavior change, habit change, I guess, is there anything else specific with? Is it? I guess, speaking of niche and the type of people that you work with? Like, is it more of a certain mindset that your clients hold? Or? Yeah,

Sheena Lawrick  12:42

I think so. Yeah. So I guess like, if I were to describe, like, you know, the person that, you know, I get excited about, like, so if I see a forum come through that someone's reaching out to us. And, you know, we ask a few questions and things like that on our website to kind of get a good idea of, who is this person that that's wanting to work with us? Right. So like, you know, I, typically what we'll see is, you know, some of the key phrases are tried everything. I have been dieting for my entire life, you know, can't seem to lose weight or keep weight off. You know, what's, like, ready for a change, things like that. Or maybe it's like, you know, family life trying to figure out, I'm trying to figure out what works best for me. I think that's, that's a really big one, when people kind of come to us with maybe a little bit more of like, a dieting history, I think is the big one, right? The ones that the first way to get us to say, hey, here, you know, go try another company is to tell us I need to lose, you know, 30 pounds in 30 days for my wedding. We're like, Nope, definitely not us. I you know, I admire it, go for it, do what you need to do. But we're we're more likely to, like have the person that's like, Hey, I this next year, I want to accomplish this or I've got a you know, a family reunion or you know, something coming up in two years that I want to get ready for right people that may be a little bit more realistic expectations, and whether that's their fault or not for not having really realistic expectations. That's something we can coach them through. But yeah, I think it is the people because that's, you know, I felt like I went through that right. And, you know, I've had discussions about this, like, How many times have you tried, like, you know, on other crazy things that we've done to try to, you know, change our bodies when, you know, a lot of the times when you're trying to change your body, it's mostly you know, you're you're either seeking confidence in yourself or you're seeking to change, you know, maybe a bold statement here, but something about your life that you're not happy with, right and our bodies are sometimes the easiest things that we can think of to manipulate right so that's why like, you know, people will overdo the exercise and under do the eating right, or they'll you know, things that we can we can control we put in our mouths we can control how many calories our Apple Watch says we're burning and things like that. We're trying to grasp on to things that feel tangible to change something around us that doesn't feel good, right? And you know, when your body doesn't feel Good and you don't feel good living in this space that you're in, that's a really crappy place to be. So when people can kind of when they can recognize that, and they're, they're open to suggestions, you know, other than, like, just tell me what to do. And they're open to kind of like talking, talking through things. Those are the people that I'm like, I love this, I'll grab on and like, I'll be the coach, you know, I'll be a coach for you for like the rest of your life if you need to. But it's those relationships, I think that just, I think are super important. So I know, it's kind of, again, we don't really put this on our website, because it's not really marketable. But those conversations, like when you can talk to somebody on the phone, which is, we're big on that too, you know, having constant communication with someone building that relationship, you get a good feel for if the person is ready for that, that kind of change.

Bridget Moroney  15:47

I guess, you know, again, it goes back to the whole lifestyle thing there. It's not the 30 Day Fix or anything else like that. And it and I agree with what you're saying, like there is like that, that deeper psychology there. Because, yeah, again, like you said, like you and I both have had these conversations and these experiences in our coaching, like someone may come to you with like, I want to, you know, do blank, but then as you start to peel back the onion layers, I guess you could say there's, there's something deeper there. And it is like it's maybe it's a confidence thing, maybe it's one thing that I like to kind of pick apart with clients is is values, right? Like, you know, whether and I think it's, you know, my opinion values is something that, in general, in society, people don't spend enough time really thinking about or exploring, you know, we all have values, we all have things that are important to us. But, you know, even on a subconscious level, so, I, in my opinion, I think there's, you know, when people seek nutrition, coaching, you know, on the on the outside, at least, it's kind of a, I guess, a gateway or, you know, a door towards something else there, whether it's like, Oh, I really value having, you know, enough energy and vitality for my children, whatever. Or, you know, I want to live a healthy life, I want to live a healthy and happy life. And, you know, so again, I guess, what I'm trying to say is, you know, on a, maybe they don't realize it consciously until they start having these conversations, like we're saying there.

Sheena Lawrick  17:34

Right? Well, that's a great point. Like when you reach out like you're, you know, I want to lose 10 pounds, like our first question is okay, like, I can snap my finger. You're 10 pounds lighter. What about your life has changed? What what are you are like, What? What are you most happy about? Now? You wake up tomorrow morning, the scale says your 120 instead of 130? Yeah, awesome. Like, is your life better? Like and why? Tell me why. And if it is, that's great. Like, if you can give me you know, amazing answers. I'm all for it. But like, Yeah, I'd rather work with I mean, we had a over Christmas, or right before Christmas, there was an older, like a grandfather that reached out he's like, I, I just saw my first grandchild come into the world, and I want to be here for as much of his life as I can, like, whoa, like, that's, that's somebody else on it, that gets it right. He's the guy like, yeah, if we tell him, Hey, you're gonna need to get two more hours of sleep at night. Like, it's not about eating an extra Apple every day? Or like, you know, like, can you get more sleep? Can you make time for 20 minutes more walking per day? Like, these are the things that we think are going to help your quality of life and prolong your quality of life? You know, can you do that? Like, that's, that's the guy that's like, yeah, absolutely. You know what I mean? And, you know, we kind of keep coming back to this lifestyle stuff. And it is, it's like, we're asking people to make these like fundamental changes to their life that like they, they've been doing things a certain way, for however many years, 20 30 40 years, you've been going to bed at the same time, or like sleeping in or not that sleeping in his bed or waking up at a certain time and not getting enough sleep or, you know, having a two glasses of wine per night for how many years like, we're going to ask you to make some super uncomfortable changes. But they're their changes that again, if you can stick to them. And while they feel uncomfortable, like that uncomfortable change is always what leads to, you know, the change that you're looking for, right? Or the uncomfortable choices, I guess you should say is, that's what leads to change, right? The stress of or that friction of making a different choice than you're used to. Which is again, again, the gateway is nutrition, right? If we can say Hey, eat a little bit more protein, eat an apple, it won't, by the way, like, I want you to slip in a 20 minute walk like I am so much more happy if they get, you know, 30 more minutes of walking a week than I am if they do

Bridget Moroney  19:47

I'm I'm all about walking these days, by the way.

Sheena Lawrick  19:53

My favorite? Yeah,

Bridget Moroney  19:57

And people don't realize this Um, they always think like, oh, the you know, hitting the gym is what's going to improve whatever their health their calorie expenditure, but it's, it's, it's not and you and I know this, you know just from like but it's it's it's those daily activity things like not just you know go for go for a 30 minute walk after dinner instead of sitting down and watching Netflix like that's going to have, you know, way more ROI, I guess that's just still go to the gym.

Sheena Lawrick  20:27

Yeah. Which seems such an easy thing, right? Like you could tell somebody he after dinner go for a 30 minute walk or 20 minute walk. But the number of people like that would actually take that advice and do it. I think I think they're, they're in that like, 1%. Like, it's so small, but the ones that do do it. I mean, they see, you know, like you said a huge ROI. Like, it's just such an easy answer. But I think sometimes for people easy means they're not trying hard enough, right? Like, I'd rather if I go to the gym twice for 45 minutes, and I'm on the elliptical and and sweaty for two minutes, two times a week, that's better than a, you know, 20 minute walk six days a week where I would say, oh, complete opposite, like flip those. You know what I mean?

Bridget Moroney  21:07

Like the whole decades of behavior, like that's something that I bring up quite a bit to like, and again, going back to people who maybe are looking for those quick fixes, or maybe you're just looking into nutrition or lifestyle changes, we'll say, like, on that superficial level is like, you're not going to correct things in 30 days, 60 90, even a year, like, as I as I often say to people like this is years sometimes, like you said, like in the case of like maybe a grandfather or a grandparent like decades of behavior that and you didn't get this way overnight, it's not going to change overnight. So, um, well, so So something so talking about, I guess, going a little bit deeper into the behavior and the mindset and the psychology of it. Something that that that you use in your coaching is, is I believe it's was identity statements, identity based habits. It's from James Clear, and Atomic Habits. Yeah.

Sheena Lawrick  22:06

Yeah. So I love that book. I think I first heard him on a podcast, maybe like a couple years ago was before Atomic Habits came out. I think it was on like, Jay for I'm gonna totally butcher his name, Jay Firoozeh, or something like that, like a strong type of lifting podcast. But I was just blown away. And I was doing my daily walk, which was awesome. It was in the middle of winter in Chicago, which I'm super proud of. I love walking in the podcast. It's like it's so meditative. For me, it's amazing. But I remember hearing him talk and like I hadn't read his book yet. And I like was downloading the audiobook. As soon as as soon as I heard him talk. And the just the simplicity for anybody that's read Atomic Habits, they'll totally understand it, right? There's simplicity with which he like, breaks down the you know, the process of forming habits had to keep habits and things like that, it just completely blew my mind. And I was like, this is like I need like ever I was writing down everything he was saying. And I was like, this is just such a simple way to like pass on information to clients, like trying to say this, try and say things in like 800 words like I normally do. And like you could be saying them in three. So yeah, it's something that we really love. And again, like for clients that we you know, that kind of come all in and are ready to like develop that relationship with us. It's something I like to introduce usually within like, the first month or two of working together. And it does kind of get a little bit personal. So like to give time for that to jump in there. But yeah, we have like a, we have a template that we kind of like help them develop what we call their identity statement. And the identity statement again, bridging off of the work that he's done for anybody that's read his book to is kind of like it's it's the idea that when you have a goal, it's not necessarily that you have a goal, but you know, when you're trying to achieve something, the understanding that you know, you you don't have, you have to change what you do, but in the end, like if you're going to reach a goal, you fundamentally have to change, right? So like your choices have to be different. You're going to change as a person along this journey right along this process. And I think kind of helping people what we like to do is kind of like have them envision you know, like I'll go back to the 10 person that wants to lose 10 pounds right like let's say 10 pounds is going to take you six months so in six months from now, you've lost the 10 pounds What do you see for yourself like what kind of future do you see for yourself? Or like tell me everything possible about this person? And let's write those down and then your goal like working backwards now is every day to live your life like you're already that person like you've already lost the 10 pounds What habits do you have you know what how what type of wife brother Mother You know teacher coach, are you like what how do you live your life differently? Right. Again, you've and you and I've had these conversations it's really hard to kind of like put this stuff into words so yeah, I don't know if you want to share one of my one of my favorites. But this was from a woman that we worked together, she, she completely she just got it. And when I read it, my I just I got goosebumps for her. And I was like this is this is awesome. So remember that this isn't the person she is today, right? This is who she wants herself to be. She says I prioritize my health and happiness, my happiness is centered around self confidence. And I build on this confidence through daily intentional movement, and nourishing food choices. I choose to eat foods that fuel my lean, strong, capable body, I exercise because I deserve to feel great. And I enjoy it. How I show up and move through the world is completely within my control. So that's like, to me when I again, I read that it's just like, holy crap, it was so empowering. I got goosebumps, like, this was this was different than the person that I was working with at that time. Right? Like I but she painted a picture for herself, of who she was trying to be so clear. And just so like, you could read that and be like, okay, or like, you could look at the statement every day, which I had her do I had her put it on, like your desktop of a computer, you know, every time she'd look at it, and it just makes your it makes your decisions walking through life very easy, right? Like, do I want to order pizza for dinner? Or do I want to make myself you know, a chicken salad, like, the person I want to become chooses nourishing foods and you know, feels good about their choices? That's easy. I show up, you know, I enjoy exercise. I don't do it as a punishment. Right? I'm just little things like that. So and that that can take a while to kind of craft this statement. Right? And I mean, some people's statements have come back like pages long. And some people have been like three things right? Which it totally to the individuality here, too. But you know, it's you're you're making like these, these statements about yourself that you might not believe in yet, but you want to so how do we bridge that gap? What does that look like? Right? And even for someone who is having a hard like people struggle with self confidence, right, someone that's having a hard time even envisioning this better version of themselves, or different version of themselves, I'll have them think about somebody that they admire, like a person, you know, maybe it's a friend that that they go to the gym with somebody that, you know, they're constantly chasing in CrossFit workouts. What do you admire about that person? What do you think that person's like Life is like, right? write down some traits? And then, you know, how does this apply to you? What are these? What are some things that you want, right? I mean, I've got like, six different identity statements here. And not one of them has, has says, I am this size on the scale I am, you know, I fit into a size two or, you know, whatever, yeah, it's it, there's not these numbers, it's these feelings. And it's these characteristics. And it's these values, like you talked about earlier, that people are trying to actually achieve, right, so it's not necessarily the, again, the number on the scale, or the number of pounds, I think I would have to lose, or the percent of body composite or percent of body fat that I have to have. It's it's these traits that people are actually seeking. And these, yeah, these identity, these identities really are the identity, we should say. So that's a long winded way of saying that, I hope it hope it makes sense.

Bridget Moroney  28:05

I think it makes perfect sense. I mean, yeah, I was I was gonna bring that up and just looking at the the list, or the document that you shared, like, yeah, that was something I was going to point out is like, no one's like, I am X amount of weight, or I have lost, you know, X amount of weight. Or like you said, the, you know, they do make comments about their body, but the body is, like you said, it's more, I guess empowering statements, like, my body is lean and strong. And capable there, which, yeah, which I mean, sure, they mentioned lean, but there's not like a specific weight tied to it. It's just, you know, it's more about the function and things like that. And, and, you know, that I love I love this idea of the, the identity statements, and I've heard this, you know, personally from from other coaches and, and, you know, thought leaders, you could say, but to see to see it kind of, like kind of be broken down. And I love the fact that you, you give your clients like some time to cultivate those statements because it because it does take a long time. Like, you know, when I bring up things like values and things like that, it's you know, it's it's not just like a because again, like what I was saying before, like, you know, I believe we all we all have these thoughts or ideas like it's just maybe not consciously again, going back to like, why someone shows up for nutrition coaching, you know, this person here, you could see like, she's, she was seeking, you know, this capability these, you know, choosing foods, but maybe and I don't know what the experience was, but maybe that wasn't her initial thoughts. Maybe it was just like to clean up my diet and lose some weight there but then it's like, start thinking deeper and, and I love that I love that you know, you give your clients the opportunity to think about it because I think the parts that people miss when they when they do any type of coaching, but you know, specifically like health nutrition coaching is they think, you know, they can't be that person till the end, right. So but it's like, why not just start now? Like, really? Yeah, like, I've, you know, other coaches who say like the time is gonna pass so why not, you know, be that person now and I think it's also why a lot of people, unfortunately aren't successful because they think that, you know, this is going to happen once I once I get to that weight, instead of you know, as they say, quote unquote, doing the work there to get right.

Sheena Lawrick  30:43

So right, like being reactive, like waiting for that person to show up rather than the proactivity of like, Wait, if I if I if I if I have the ability to imagine and like know, like if I if I can. Totally cheesy here she made if I can dream it, if I can dream of this version of myself. What's stopping me from being that person today?  Right? Like, yeah, yeah, because this client is She's a perfect example. Like she, you know, her her lifestyle wasn't conducive to her identity statement. Right. So like, she had this like, it was like her painting this like version of a life that like when she then she wrote that out. And when she looked at, like, what day to day look like, she was like, none of the things I'm doing are actually in alignment with that, like, her job was super stressful. She was working crazy hours. She wasn't sleeping well. She was exercising, like exercise wasn't like she really did enjoy it. But she didn't have time for it. Right? She didn't have time for it. She didn't have time to spend with her daughter or her family like, and so one thing like, you know, we started to pull on that sweater string. And it was like, she looked for another job, found another job left, like found a job that was like, way more conducive to spending time with her daughter and allowing her to prioritize exercise and things like that. And I know that, you know, obviously, it gets tough when you bring people's jobs into it, right? Like we have to earn money to make a living, I totally get that I'm not telling anybody go out there and quit their job. But for her it was and it wasn't a quick process, right? Like it was this this this took time to unfold. But I don't know that that ever would have happened unless she had she took like the time to be like, What do I truly want for myself? Right? Because not only did she make her life better, but like, you know, she's she's probably more present for a daughter, which is awesome. And like more present for her family. She's doing work that she enjoys. You're no longer a slave to like, yeah, thinking that just because you're good at your job, doesn't mean you have to do that job. Like you're you don't owe anybody anything you can do what you want to do and still contribute to this world positively. Right? So ya nowhere in there did we say that you have to eat more, or you have to eat less? Or what? Anything like that, right? Like, we've talked about food for 10 minutes or so. But it's more about how do we get you to like, get you closer to this identity statement.

Bridget Moroney  32:52

If you've ever seen the TED talk from at Amy Cuddy. She talks about like body language and again, like how people think that our psychology or our mindset influences our our body language, but her her thought process is actually, it's the reverse. They're like, the way you sit, can influence how you feel. So a great example is you if you look at people, she uses the example of like, going into a job interview and you're, you're there in the office and like, some people are just hunched over like this, and my you know, again, it's a subconscious thing. You know, versus like, you know, she calls this executive, which for people that can't see, it's like, I'm sitting back with my, my, hands, I guess I will keep my feet up on the desk. Yeah, she has one called, like, the wonder woman there. But But yeah, so her whole so they're they're power poses. And her whole thought process behind this is if you find yourself in a in a situation where you know, you have to give a speech interview, whatever performance they are, if spend just guessing two minutes, maybe in these power poses, you can influence your your confidence and mindset in a positive way there. But one thing that she says in her in her TED Talk, is there's the saying, you know, fake it till you make it she says Don't fake it till you make it fake it to until you believe it or until you become it there. And so that that sort of came up for me talking about these identity statements again, like people think like, Oh, I'll be this person at the end. I don't I don't feel like I could like I could never be that that's always the thing too, right? Like you mentioned. You know, okay, if I can envision myself as this like vision, someone else and that that often is a statement here just in general, like you look at someone who is you know, quote unquote, really fit or disciplined or whatever. And that's always the phrase that comes out like, never be like you you're so dedicated. To like, just try like, you know this person, you know, again, like it's it's become part of their their life now it's their persona like, you can do that and you know, maybe fake it to you, you know, just fake it till you make it. Yeah, trying to embody it Yes.

Sheena Lawrick  35:14

Or having just the courage to like to try and like the the permission right to grant like I mean, as coaches we always feel like we're giving people or granting them permission, right? Like they get in their own way they think that they've got for whatever reason, like you said, like, they're like, Oh, that's not me or like, I could never do that. Right? Like, so who so who says that? Like who? Who's stopping you like you are the one stopping you? So I'm gonna go ahead and say, Yes, you can. And here's a really like, small, small way to start, right? If you're if you're someone who like you want to get in shape, or like you, you want to like exercise, or you want to find a way to prioritize exercise, and you're currently not going to the gym then like, I mean, the last thing I'm gonna tell somebody to do is go to the gym four times this week, or, you know, like, that's, that's the goal, like no way, like the goal, as like James Clear says in his book, like, You got to be the person that like is okay to go to the front door and put your shoes on to get in the car to drive to the gym. Like, let's start there. And again, it seems like one of those small little things where it's like a 30 minute walk after dinner, which everybody's like, Oh, that's good. I can do that no one does it. Like no one does that no one goes to the put their shoes on gets in the car and is like, No, I don't want to go to the gym. Like usually, if you get to the car, and you get to the gym, like you'll do something, right. But as a coach, like I'm gonna give someone permission and be like, That is the goal this week, the goal is to like put your shoes on, get to the car. And like if we do that, and you'd make your way to the gym, I'm happy because like, you know what, Wednesday, that decision is going to be easier. And then you're going to go to the gym, and you're probably going to spend a little bit more time there. And like, you know, they're going to feel better, hopefully, if they're at the right place, right? We can insert whatever food recommendation here, right? Like, I want you to add half a piece of chicken to your, your lunch, or I want you to try to add one color, one different color of vegetable to dinner, right? Like easy things like that, where we're just, we're opening up people's minds and giving them the permission to kind of like think differently about not only themselves but the world around them and how it's set up, right? Because that word, we came back to at the beginning should right like, I should do this, like, again, no one, no one is in charge of you, but you like you get to you get to decide what your diet is how you live your life, you know, whatever, as your family and things like that, too. But just that that empowerment, I think people are really missing it. They're like they're leaving it up to chance and like this complete, just like, I'm gonna react to the world around me, like the world is going to act on me. And I'm gonna just gonna sit here and take it rather than being a lot more proactive in their life. Or, I mean, you've probably seen this too, there were people that obsess about like, well, this program is four weeks instead of six weeks or like I'm done this program, what do I do now? It's, I mean, I mean, lift something heavy, if you want, like your body can be enough of a machine like, you know, you can do resistance training in your living room, you really can, like you absolutely can we obsess over these like, yeah, I gotta find the right the perfect program. Like unless you're training for the 100 meter sprint and the Olympics. Like you don't need the perfect program. You just find something you enjoy. If you like dancing dance, like awesome. If you like rowing go row if you don't want to CrossFit because it's crazy, like, don't do it. You just find something that you'd like to do, you know? Okay, Mission granted.

Bridget Moroney  38:19

It's all effective. And, and there's a there's another coach out. Are you familiar with EC Synkowski Optimize me? Yeah, she's awesome. She's I like her a lot. But I guess she always brings us up says her. She doesn't have nutrition rules. She has principles, which I like, and I can't remember if this is one of her principles, or just something she says, but it's, you're majoring in the minors. Right? Like, again, like, Don't Don't worry about if this is a four week program versus a six week program. And if there's, you know, 12 reps versus 10, like just move and and same thing for nutrition. Like, you know, it's yeah, it's people people get so caught up in the minutia of everything that it kind of it's a it's that analysis paralysis, as they say,

Sheena Lawrick  39:09

Totally, totally. And it sucks too, because like our industry is at fault for that, right? Like when we, when there's enough information out there where people are scared of the high sugar fruits and vegetables like carrots and bananas and like berries, like oh, I had too many I ate too much watermelon today, like, no, no, you didn't. Like you want to beat yourself up about something else. Like that's that's okay with me. Like, I didn't go for your 20 minute walk. But you don't tell me that you ate you know too much. You know, you ate two bananas and you ruined your day. Like that's I wish we could control a little bit more of that. But

Bridget Moroney  39:41

I know it's there. I know. It's a it is an industry thing. And I hope I see there. There are some trainers and coaches and nutritionists out there who are trying you know, like yourself, who are trying to be more responsible in their messaging and things like that, but It's it's kind of Yeah, one it's the messaging. It's the marketing of everything. Because, you know, it's not like the things we're talking about here like a 30 minute walk after. After work or don't Don't worry. Yeah, it's not sexy. And that's the thing like, yeah, what what it takes to like live a, you know, a healthy and well life is very boring. Very boring.

Sheena Lawrick  40:24

It is. It's super simple. And it doesn't make for good. Yeah, Twitter tweets or Instagram posts, like, I mean, I'm sure you feel right, like, you could have one Instagram post that's like, here's do these four things every day. You're welcome. Like, you don't need to, you don't need to hire me.

Bridget Moroney  40:39

Well, and that's the thing too, like, yeah, it's, it's, it's, I don't know, it's a big system. But, um, but going back to the small thing, so like, I'm looking at your the document that you shared? Is it okay? If I don't want to, like, give any spoilers away? Okay, hold on, let me share what I what I loved about so you have like, kind of the questionnaire and then you put down, you know, three to five incredibly small steps that you can take today, not like tomorrow. And it reminded me of another coach, that she's more of the the business side of things, Marie Forleo. But she she says that in one of her books as well, it's like, do the steps now. And I just love that approach. Because I think, again, people think that you need to take these big, grand, you know, steps, these big grand gestures. And of course, they get intimidated, they get overwhelmed, and they don't do it. But it's like, yes, start now. Or another thing that I love is the the five minute action there. That's, you know, kind of comes up. Yeah. Yeah,

Sheena Lawrick  41:49

I think it's just it's realistic, right? And I guess I always come back to like, people are like, Okay, well, that's, that's not hard enough, right. And it's like, okay, but if it's, if it's not, I don't want it to be hard, because what you're doing right now isn't working, right. And so I need you to take like, I need you to to get a small win, even if it's small. And that win is then going to lead to the next one. And it's going to go to the next thing. And it's eventually going to get us the win for you that feels big, right? So if it's somebody, their only time to exercise, let's say is, you know, 6:30 in the morning, and they have to do it. So like, instead of setting the goal of like, okay, you have to like you're gonna do exercise at 6:30, right? Instead, I'm going to be like, Okay, you're going to three small things you can do right now you can set out your clothes the night before, or you can even sleep in them, whatever, you're going to set your alarm. And you're going to, you know, fill up your water bottle the night before, so that in the morning, you've got like, you've already made it a little bit easier on yourself so that were 2, 3, 3 steps closer to actually get into that 6:30 workout, right? If you didn't get the 6:30, that's fine. But if you did those three things, chances are you're probably going to be, you're more likely to get that workout in, right? And we're not going to like if you didn't do it once, we're not going to like give up on it. If those three things didn't work, we're going to find the next three things that did right. Maybe it's whatever, maybe you're maybe you're a nighttime person, maybe the 6:30am is actually unrealistic for you. It doesn't fit your lifestyle. That's cool. Let's try working out at 8:30 at night. How does that how does that go? Right? Like we're just, but it's again, giving people the, again, the empowerment and like taking away the I don't want to say it's a victim mentality, but taking away that reactive kind of feeling. Maybe they even move their alarm clock out of the room, right? So they have to go turn it off. If they're up. Maybe they do the workout, right. But those are the kinds of steps that people like, again, they have to do because they're not doing them right now. It clearly it's not happening. That's why you hired me like something isn't? Something's not happening, right? And yeah, it might feel weird to pay me to tell you to set your alarm. But like, I'm gonna start where we need to start because we're not even going to talk about your food until we figure out you know, how do we get you feeling good about your body? Right, moving in the morning,

Bridget Moroney  43:53

but you said it perfectly. Like there's there's a reason why people you know, a client isn't doing these things in the first place here. So it's like, let's break it down. Like, okay, you want to work out like you said, it's 6:30. But why is it is it? Is it a? Is it a sleep time? Is it like just not off the schedule? Are you just not planning properly? Um, yeah, it's, I think that's something like, the things that you kind of mentioned made me think of just like, environmental triggers or optimization there, I guess you could say. Like, that is like, I feel like that's kind of, I guess, you could say, a hack. One of the best hacks to get people to change their behavior. Like yeah, I love the I've because I've done it myself, the, the alarm clock or the phone, like across the room or whatever. Because yeah, that'll that'll get you up. And then and then it kind of reinforces because again, all of our, like, our brains are built for efficiency, right? So you know, the reason You know, the fact that someone's not getting up at 6:30 in the morning, you know, isn't a moral failing, you're not a, you're not a piece of trash, like you're a scumbag that's lazy. There's just something that you know, isn't working in your life. And, again, going back to the idea of like, it's years, sometimes even decades of behavior that got changed. Like, if I'm used to sleeping until seven, you know, well, yeah, it's gonna take a minute to relearn to get up at this time. And, and if my automatic speaking specifically, in this case, literally myself, my automatic reaction is the hit snooze. Well, I need to I need to stop that, that action. And then when I get out of bed, it's like that trigger like, oh, yeah, I'm supposed to be, you know, getting on with my day at this point, or whatever it is, I've decided.

Sheena Lawrick  45:52

Yeah, yeah, I think you're totally right. And like people, I, most people that I've dealt with will immediately go to that, like, Oh, I'm lazy. I didn't, I didn't wake up in time, or like, or, you know, I'm lazy, if I don't work out in the morning, or whatever. I'm, like, you know, like working out in the morning, and you don't like working out? Like, those are two like huge obstacles already. Like, you know, if we're trying to get you to like exercise, let's at least find a time of the day that you like, you know, you can fit in anything. I mean, even if it is during lunch, or if it's like, if it's right after work, like whatever, like there's no, I think, again, there's just these, like, there's these I should be doing this kind of thing. And it's like, Where's that coming from? Like, if you if you actually tell me, where are you think this, like this magical person is like, that's making all the rules for your life is telling you that if you don't work out at 6:30am, you're lazy. Like, that's, that's you telling you that like, so let's, let's change that. Let's let's let's stop that behavior. And you're totally right. Like, yeah, imagine somebody Yeah, working with somebody who's, you know, 30 years of like, not working out in the morning. And then they, you know, year 31, all of a sudden, they're supposed to love it. Like, it's, that's not gonna happen.

Bridget Moroney  46:55

Um, I want to ask this in the beginning. And I know, it's, we've been having like, such a great, like, open, open kind of discussion here. So this is kind of like more of just like a kind of, I don't know, close, like, the teacher and me coming out. It's a closed answer. But I'm just curious. Because because a lot of the things that you're talking about do speak to long term change. Do you have like a, I guess, like a contract requirement? Like I like, for example, I know, there's there's certain coaches out there that are like, you're working with me for a year. You know, because because of like, exactly what he said like it does. Spoiler alert to anyone listening, it really does take that long. You know, but anyway, yeah. Do you have that I'm just, I'm just curious.

Sheena Lawrick  47:45

So we don't like it's, again, that this is the part of our business, I think that's always changing. You know, in the past business coaches have told us like, hey, you know, you should be charging for three months upfront, or you should be these 3, 6, 9, 12 contracts. Like, in the end, what we found feels best to us is just monthly. And so we don't, I mean, we're very honest from the beginning, like, if someone's like, you know, if they have 50 pounds to lose, like, we're like, Hey, this is probably going to take this amount of time, like, and I get that, you know, we're, you know, it's, it's tough because, you know, you're you're still in it for like a, you know, as a business model, you're like, Okay, we're just going to do this, this monthly. And as long as it's working for you, I want to I'm going to still be here. We always say like our biggest our, our greatest day is when someone tells us they're ready to graduate. Like, we like to call it the best breakup ever. Like we don't my goal from like, day one is that one day, you don't need me, right? I don't, I don't want you to feel like you're locked into this for any amount of time, especially if we you know, for whatever reason, you know, just it wasn't a good fit, right? Like, that's, that's okay, if I'm, you know, digging into your life too much. And it's like, you really just do want somebody to tell you what to eat. Totally fine. Like, that's, that's your, that's your personality. It's, that's great. So we haven't we haven't done that yet. Maybe we'll in the in the future. I don't know if it kind of helps set people's expectations of like, Hey, this is a year long program because some things do take that long, right? And, but we've been we've known to, like work to people work with people to you know, just in terms of like their timeframes to and just kind of set up a you know, whatever, whatever works for them. So, we're a little bit different in that sense, probably not a great business model, but we're, we're in it for the coaching.

Bridget Moroney  49:26

No, I totally get it. I mean, there's yeah, there's that's I guess another Oh, thank you. I honestly was just kind of curious because there like you said, there are so many different business models out there and I think it's just kind of I don't know what you want for your business and what you want for your clients and I totally appreciate and respect you know, especially I've Well, there's a couple of things one I've had to kind of go separate ways with with clients before because it just my style or what they were looking to get didn't work and that's okay. Like, I think that's, you know, I like I said, I respect kind of working or coaching from that place of integrity there because, you know, like you said, like, we get into this business coaches get into this business not for the fame and the glory. It's it is, in my at least in my experience, it is from like, a genuine position of trying to help people. And so, but also the whole, like you say, graduate thing, like I, I had a massage therapists say this, he was a sports massage therapist who said this to me, like years ago, and I liked it, he said, the biggest compliment that a client can ever give me is that they don't need me anymore. Because I'm, you know, they're no longer in pain and things like that. And, and I kind of echo that in coaching as well, you know, especially kind of like, what type of coaching or nutrition coaching that you and I are talking about, like, the behavior change the habit change, it's empowering. Like, if a person no longer needs my services as coach, that means for the right reasons, not that that's yeah, it means that I've done my job that they now feel confident enough to go on and make their own decision. Because at the you know, it's goes back to that that proverb there, you know, teach teach a person to fish, you know, feed them for life, they're so

Sheena Lawrick  51:27

Totally, and what a cool place to be right? Like we like, if you could tell somebody that from day one, like, hey, one day, you're not going to need me one day, you will never be confused about nutrition again, or fitness, like you'll just one day, you know, what this is my identity statement for you in the future is that you're gonna love exercise, you're not going to be confused by it, you're going to do it because you enjoy it, you're going to eat foods that you know, feel like that feel good to you, you know, most of the time, you're going to have some flexibility around like, I'm not going to tell you never to eat pizza and drink beer again. But like, you're going to do it in a way that feels good to you. And these, these aren't going to be my rules, these are going to be your rules, we're going to create your own, like, your own healthy lifestyle with that and your it it's going to be called the blah, blah, blah, diet, like whatever, insert person's name here. And that's going to be totally okay. Like, that's what we're signing up for. And what a cool place to be right like that just kind of, I don't even know if it's, as I say it now, like gives me just like a complete sense of like relief, because I think most people come just like, again, totally confused, not knowing what to do, they don't feel any empowerment. They don't feel just feel like they're, you know, susceptible to the world around them instead of like, you know, power posing up and walking.

Bridget Moroney  52:37

Yeah, just do the Wonder Woman pose, you know, or like, you know, like, I would say, you know, never say never, but you know, even if, even if they do feel confused or anything, like they still have that confidence in themselves to figure it out there. Like you said, like you mentioned before, like, instead of being reactive, like, oh, well, you know, this is just it, it's like, more responsive, maybe, you know, and maybe they do kind of seek whatever coaching then because they need extra resources and things but it's, it's, again, from that place of empowerment of like, you know, versus I think, you know, a lot of times or often you may see people who are, I guess for lack of a better word, like defeated, like you said, like, going back to like what you said in the beginning, like, I've tried everything, it's, you know, I don't wanna say rock bottom. Because that just seems like, extreme, but I don't know.

Sheena Lawrick  53:35

Yeah, no, that's true. I think like one of the, you know, what am I like, like, memories from a coach. Like, I think one thing that actually changed the way I coach to was, and you and I have talked about this, like I used to, you know, at the gym, I used to run like 30 day challenges, or, you know, Paleo challenges and things like that, which all have like, looking back. Now, I'm glad that I did those because everything is really experienced, right? It's, it's only a mistake, if you don't take the time to learn from experiences, right. And I would have people that would go through, you know, 30 day challenges, and they would feel awesome. They're like, This is so great. You know, we do that before and after body composition, and their photos are great. And then, you know, they would come to me, like on Day 32, 33 day 34 And they're like, Okay, I ate I ate gluten. And I blew up, you know, or I had, I had dairy and I was on, you know, I couldn't keep anything down or like, you know, I had a beer and I feel terrible. Like, what do I do now? Right? And it was like, you know, that learning moment of okay, we set this like, and this is kind of where Beyond the Box came from to our name is like, you know, don't have like, your, your life shouldn't be lived in this little box. Right? Like it's got to be what what does happen on day 31? Like, what does have been when you want to introduce or you want to go out with your friends on a Friday night, you've had a really good week, you know, whatever that means, like you have to set up your diet in a way that that feels good to you and is realistic, like yeah, you work hard Monday through Friday, like go home. Have a beer, go have some pizza, whatever like and then know that you've got a plan that you can come back to that feels good. So it's not about living in this like cage, right? It's about being being open and being available to, like, be outside of that. But also, you have to give yourself you have to probably learn compassion and patience and grace with yourself too. And not beat yourself up. If you do have the pizza and beer and you feel like crap for maybe like, you know, the next morning or whatever, but like, knowing that you have the, you have the ability to turn it around anytime you want, or just to not even turn it around. But get back on, on on your plan, right? One analogy that we use that I love is like instead of living your life on like a single lane highway, like, Canada has these awesome six ways that I used to love. You don't you can stay like just you know, your life can be lived in that in that six lane like you can you can veer all around, right you can be you can have good days, you can have bad days, but just whatever your plan is like stay on your plan and be okay with that plan. And not like confine yourself to these such these such small restrictions. So long story short, you whatever you sparked in my head that, you know, patience and grace and things like that, and like what, you know, not not limiting yourself into these these tiny little these tiny little buckets and just being okay with that again, that's that's the permission that I think as coaches we like to grant to people who just really open Yeah,

Bridget Moroney  56:18

I know, I love that. And yeah, like, like you mentioned, you're you and I have had our own conversations around like the challenges. And I don't I I think and I've kind of like learned my own lessons too, from the challenges like, like, yeah, like, absolutely agree. Like, you know, that that little 30 day window or box there? Like, again, it's like, what happens on day? 31 or32? Like, I don't know, if I could read as in, there's, there's no like, I don't know, there's no perfect way I think, I think these challenges are good in some ways for people, like I'll say, I'll use myself as an example. I'm someone who gets motivated by a challenge and also admit that I'm someone who has fallen victim to that that day. 31 of like, oh, you know, like, Yeah, but, but now realizing kind of how I'm wired like it, it can be a good way to kind of get yourself, you know, whatever re motivated. Things like that. But, but but I think there is something that is that is missing, and especially like in gyms and things like that is like that transition, like the education or the conversation around the transition, like exactly what you just said, like, okay, you know, we've taught you or you've experienced this new way of living it, you know, you find it, it's worked well for you like that, you know, now the decision is, how are you going to proceed from here? Are you going to live this way for the rest of your life? 100% of the time, does that does that work for you? Does that make cool? Do you really want to do that, you know, a little bit of the time, like we're you know, again, giving them permission. You know, cuz, you know, speaking specifically about things like you know, since since you and I both come from the the CrossFit background there and paleo, it's kind of dogmatic. I'm just gonna say like, it's very, like I've been Yeah. You know, when they used to have regionals back in the day getting old. But I was I was at regionals on a team one year and we all went out to dinner. And of course, they bring the bread basket and everyone's just looking at it, and it's just like, yeah, dude you just like worked out all day? Just eat a frickin biscuit like carbs. It's okay. Paleo, it's like, Good lord. We're on the other end. This is the part that I personally find problematic is like, The Last Supper, like, you know, it's like, okay, we're starting our paleo or whatever challenge now, you know, but I've seen people it's like, go to Olive Garden. Go to like, like, they do like a frickin buffet like ice cream. That's like, again, like no one told you that you could never have this again. And it's only six weeks like you know, so. Again, I guess that's just kind of my own thoughts on like, the problems around it and just kind of echoing what you said about the permission again, like that great permission slip that we can offer people Yeah,

Sheena Lawrick  59:35

that like that that person that like I'm picturing, right like that's someone and we're like, I want to like dig into their psyche and be like, Okay, what is it like why are you Why do you feel like this like yeah, the Last Supper like what is going to change about like your you do you think like, is it happiness like, are you literally trying to like, you think that you're going to be so miserable for six weeks or whatever? 30 days that you're literally like every piece of food is just is like you're making up for Happiness l\ost like, and then present that to someone and not trying to, like therapists or anything here. But if you present it to someone like that, or people actually took the time to kind of like, think about why they're making the choice they're making, none of it makes sense. You're like, wait, I can, you know, I can go to Olive Garden any day I want really? Like, it's not like going anywhere, right? Or like, yeah, like, I mean, some people every, like, if food doesn't taste like restaurant quality, or if it's like, not, you know, quote, like, you know, an eight out of 10 food for every meal, like they're unhappy, and then they try to overeat at the next meal. It's like, there's, there's so much that goes on with that stuff that. I know, there are people that very much struggle with, like, you know, real, real disorders around around food, but, you know, it's just, it's, it is it's such like the the human psyche, that part of it is super interesting to me. So. Yeah, I agree. I think like having, you know, coaches, at least if they're putting on these challenges and stuff like that at the gym, or just have the have the expectation talk with people, right, like, I know, 75 hard is another one that we've talked about. I haven't done it personally. But it's it is it's super cool. I think it's like a note, like, when you look at it, fundamentally of like, what it's trying to teach you, like, get outside more awesome workout more awesome. You know, stick to whatever diet makes sense to you. Awesome, drink more water, awesome. All those things are great. If you're, if you're somebody that can handle that many things at once, like making that many changes. Great. If you're not like, Okay, what's what's something else you can do? And then what are our expectations? Coming through this, like, at day 76? You know, how do you want to be like, it's your life now? Like, you don't have this this box around it? Like, do you what do you want to take from that challenge? Or what do you want to take from that experience, I should say that you can then bring into your life, right? Keep and choose what you want to keep in and get, get rid of what you don't and then don't feel bad if you don't read 10 pages on day 76 Because like no one again, is judging you. There's not a you know, unless you're in a Facebook community of people that are like, and if they're shaming you, they're probably not people they want you want in life anyway. But well, it's just I don't know, I just I think again, having that realistic expectation with people because people are so hungry for change. If you're signing up for something like that, like your there is something within you that like, again, it could just be the challenge, I get that. But like, if it's around like body image stuff with people like they're so they can be so desperate to feel differently about themselves that they they won't have the foresight to look past day 75. And they'll want to just be told what to do, right? trust somebody else, because somebody else said, this is going to work. There is no, there's no empowerment, there's no ownership over it, right. And they'll just they'll trust that, like, they're going to be different on day 76. They'll just trust that, right. And then day 76 comes, and maybe they don't keep up with whatever, you know, all 18 habits that it has. And then they're back at square one, right. And they're still the same person is when they started with a little bit of a different experience. But if someone can help them learn, and like take things from that experience and apply it to their life in a way that makes sense to them, then that then that challenge was a success. But it could also, you know, be not a success for someone who's not in the right mindset, you know what I mean? So, kind of small tangent, and that's not just 75 hard. That's any challenging? Yeah.

Bridget Moroney  1:03:09

Yeah, absolutely. Um, do you think you would ever do like I know, like, the the way your you know, your business and your your coaching, you know, a setup nowadays is is very different than, you know, your past experience. But do you think you would ever if you had a chance again? Would you ever do a challenge again? And if so, like, how would you redesign it? Because I'm assuming, probably redesign it? Yeah.

Sheena Lawrick  1:03:36

So it's funny you asked like, so one of our one of our employees is actually she's a coach at a gym here in Chicago. And I think I'm kind of I'm kind of out of the loop right now, as you know, I'm pregnant. But she put together like a, I think, a 50 day challenge. And I don't know a lot about it. So I don't want to like go too crazy on it. But she, she she was somebody that thrived on the 75 hard and she loved it. And again, I'd love to you know, I need to learn more about her experience. But I know that she was in a place where she had the time to commit to it. She's a coach herself. So I think she had the right mentality going in and in and out of it. And I think she wanted to pass that on to people. So I'm curious to see how it goes. I think it was a 50 day thing. Maybe just trying to cut down on the time there. And I know there's variations of this. There's is there like a soft 75 Now to or like a different? I don't know. Yeah, I'm sure there's many different variations. Right. But it's a great question. I have thought about it. I'm like what, you know, if you were to like, you know, I won't even say like a brand. Like how would I How would I pack a package up everything that I would want to teach someone into like a program? What would it look like? You know, honestly, coming back to that year long thing would probably be something that would be more of like a year commitment. And it would be it would include grace. So it would include like, you know, the goal of this is to, you know, let's stick to these healthy habits 80% of the time and like actually have a calendar as to like, you know, 365 days. What is 80 percent like, what? How many days in a year you get yourself not including like holidays and things like that? It wouldn't be it wouldn't be sexy, it would be like, how many steps did you get per week? How many? How many hours of sleep? Did you get? You know, did you? Did you prioritize self care? Did you, you know, how many different colors of vegetables that you eat? You don't go back to, you know, just different different stuff like that. And it just, if I were to put it on paper, it would it would look so, you know, again, not sexy. But it wouldn't.

Bridget Moroney  1:05:31

The non sexy  diet challenge coming out 2023 January 1, but

Sheena Lawrick  1:05:37

I like the group mentality part. I think that's, that's super, you know, the community engagement, I think is really helpful for some people too. So, and I haven't done it. So I don't want to like I don't want to knock on the program. I just think it's, it's all in how you can apply it to yourself, right, and how you then take what you're learning and move forward. I think that's just that's such a missing piece in, in our industry, and people just you know, because they want to take, you know, here's my, here's my whatever $100 to participate in your challenge. And once that timeframe is up, then it's then it's done. You know,

Bridget Moroney  1:06:08

that's like, yeah, so I totally agree, I think you you know challenges in general or if I were to greet like, and again, it's not very exciting, but there would be at least like, I don't know, a week or a couple of like, of that transition time of like the I guess the debrief here. It's like, okay, you went through this, you know, experience for the past, whatever. 30, 75 days are much like, okay, what are you going to do now going forward? Like that? Because again, I you know, I don't know, it's just my my opinion or experience. Like, I think every diet works. And every diet doesn't work. Right? Not every diet is sustainable. For sure. Exactly. Yeah. Like it. Yeah, it can definitely. And you know, like we said in the beginning I've I've tried diets, I haven't tried carnivore.

Sheena Lawrick  1:07:00

Yeah, I don't think it would be that difficult. I think I could do it. Maybe for like if I like ate. Yeah, but like, what's the point? Like, you just I don't know, I like I like a colorful plate. I like you know, I spend my time eating vegetables. And now as an adult that I actually like them like, you know, it's kind of nice to include them and include them at weird times of day. That's I don't know if you've heard like we've done a challenge people to eat salads at breakfast when they're ready for it. It's such a weird like, it's such a weird concept for people that they're like, Wait, like, you want me to eat a salad at breakfast? Like yeah, what's like, again? Who's telling you that you shouldn't right like society? That we shouldn't that we should only have salads at lunch or dinner like what what is not okay about eating vegetables at breakfast? Like, no one can ever give you a right answer right.

Bridget Moroney  1:07:42

Little stuff like Bergeron Oh, sorry. I like I liked that idea. It kind of reminds Ben Bergeron brought that up. I heard like a couple years ago, he I guess is principles of nutrition. And one of them is like a vegetable. I can't remember. It's a green vegetable or just a vegetable. at every meal. Yes. Including breakfast. Yes. And it's like, yeah, went like. Yeah, have a salad like you said or whatever. Just I prefer cooked vegetables.

Sheena Lawrick  1:08:13

Yeah, it's fine. Cook them up. Yeah, like I mean, throw you know, spinach, you put it in a whole pot and like cook it down and have it be done. And you know, two forkfuls so, but yeah, again, like people for whatever reason, that's just like, that's not it's not a habit, right. It's are the habit is pour your Cheerios, you know, in a bowl and put some milk on it, and that and that's fine, too. But if you want to, if you're truly looking to make a change, then that's one of the places like if you're going to eat vegetables at breakfast, you're probably going to make a pretty good choice at lunch. Probably going to make sure there's those small wins adding up, right that we're doing both so

Bridget Moroney  1:08:45

I'm gonna do that I'm gonna I'm gonna get back into I like that. I also like, I'm so I'm so bad at this. You talk about like, the colorful plate there. And it um, it took me a while to embrace other vegetables even even even like, yeah, I don't know. Kristin is very good about very keen on vegetables. And that's always like, I've gotten better in recent years. But when she would go away and travel for business that was like, always her concern is like, like, Yeah, seriously? Yeah, it's like, yeah, my wife is my mother here.

Sheena Lawrick  1:09:27

We've met a few people that we've worked with, like athletes in general, like we've worked with a few teen teen athletes, that I've had to tell them like, eating vegetables is a part of your job as an athlete, like, I don't care if you like them, like just it's a part of your job. And the same with adults. I'm like, look like if you're, you know, you've got a kid right? Like you tell your kid eat the vegetables like you need to do it too. And the people that like, here's, I mean, I think I think EC Synkowski is that sir? I'm saying her name right. Sorry. I'm seeing her like stuff on Instagram, but I'm not . Yes. Yeah, that's how she did like the grams of vegetables per day right. Instagram vegetable.

Bridget Moroney  1:10:01

Sorry, the 800 gram challenge. Yeah. I love that a good one. Have you tried that?

Sheena Lawrick  1:10:07

I haven't. But I think like, I mean, it's I've just, I've gotten so away from weighing and measuring my food that I just didn't want to do that. I can't remember who else five different colors. Somebody else told us, I learned that somewhere, trying to chat like challenge people to get five different colors of fruits and vegetables in per day. I mean, you could do you could go so far. So like fruits don't count, you can still eat fruit, obviously. But like five different colors of vegetables, right? Like, that's like the one goal. So if I have somebody that likes, you know, being challenged, I've got this hockey player, that's just, she's, she's awesome to work with. She just takes everything and loves it. And she loves the challenge. And I challenge I'm like, let's try five different colors of vegetables every day. And we worked our way up we went, we started with 2, 3, 4. And then you know, because then that gets them into the education piece to where it's like, okay, what, like, what are my purple options? What are my orange options? What are my red options, right? And finding creative ways to like, you know, build your meals around those vegetables too salads are obviously very easy stir fry, you know, smoothies, stuff like that, but, and you find stuff that you like, and you like you didn't know that you actually liked pepper or you didn't know that you liked purple cabbage, whatever. But yeah, like when you look at your plate, and you just can kind of be proud of like, oh, man, this is super healthy. Right. And just a way to kind of mix it up a bit.

Bridget Moroney  1:11:25

Yeah, no, that's awesome. I'm really quick talking about so you mentioned like, kind of working with with athletes. There;s a couple athletes. I guess. You know, in comparison to your your lifestyle clients, like is your approach different? Like you mentioned, getting them into the habit of eating vegetables and making some sort of, you know, you know, I'm assuming lifestyle changes, like, is there any difference? In your approach to working with them? I guess, in general, because obviously, as athletes, there are certain in season, you know, out of season goals that they may or may not have, but yeah, I don't know, in general, is there any difference?

Sheena Lawrick  1:12:07

Yeah, I think so. The athletes I work with or again, for whatever, they seem to be younger. So we've we've kind of we've developed a really good relationship with a rowing like a boathouse here in Chicago. So we've worked with quite a number of like teen rowers, which is really cool. And then just a female athlete part like I just been connected to some female athletes that are you know, NCAA stuff. I do. So for them, it's more about I love I love kind of getting in at that age, because it is about habit development. So like they like to say to haven't been broken yet. Right. So we can kind of like if I would have loved to have had the opportunity to work with, you know, somebody a little bit more nutrition minded when I was young. And I think it would have been, yeah, it just, it just could have made some really cool differences. But again, you know, everything's a learning experience. So being able to kind of like, show them what food could do for their bodies really young, I think is really cool. So for the athletes, like, I mean, we haven't met a young athlete yet that we have, like, we've been able to fit enough food into their, into their diets, they burn so many calories, and our body is so efficient at using quality nutrition, right? So like, helping them understand one like that carbs aren't bad, but that's still a hate, I hate that that's still around. We show them how to like build complete meals, right? Like you're after, you know, I want you to here's what protein looks like, here's your carbohydrate sources and like, we include fruits, vegetables, potatoes, rice, you know, Gatorade if they need it, right? And like, when's the appropriate time to have these quicker sugars when when is when do we want to have the you know, the the starchy carbs that have a little bit more fiber or things like that. So helping them learn that and then like, when they go off to college, they know how to, like create a meal, right? When they are presented with, you know, billions of you know, buffet options or whatever. So I think with with athletes, I can get a little bit more we still work on habits, obviously. But it's a little bit more, Hey, are you getting enough of something? Which is which is really fun. And then, you know, maybe clients that aren't as athlete focused? It's still honestly, it's still about getting enough, right? Like, are you getting enough protein? Are you getting enough fruit and vegetables? Are you getting enough water? You know, very rarely are we kind of in a restrictive mode unless, you know somebody has been doing a lot of different stuff so but yeah, you know, it's still it is still a mentality approach and a you know, laying that foundation of like, we want them we want them to understand why we're suggesting these changes like what's what's it gonna do for them in the future? Not just like a eat this type thing. So I don't know if that makes sense.

Bridget Moroney  1:14:40

No, I'm it makes perfect sense. And I love that you're that you're having that influence, especially, you know, again, talking about like female athletes and, you know, so I used to work at a golf and tennis academy. They're obviously all athletes there and I was on the academic side at the time. I am but I'm just going into the lunch room there and seeing the choices that they made. And not even that, but just the choices that were given to them was also just like, I don't know, not ideal.

Sheena Lawrick  1:15:17

Yeah convenience is a big, big issue really.

Bridget Moroney  1:15:22

Totally. But, um, but also so there's, there's still, you know, quite a few students that I keep in touch with, at least on on social media. And, and one, one girl posted I guess, a couple couple months ago, this video so so she's a golfer at Stanford, and she posted this video, and I'm glad people are talking about these things. But it was a video from I think she was a softball athlete at Stanford, and it was basically this young lady, this young woman talking about her, basically her history with with an eating disorder as an athlete. And, and again, so so talking about, like, you know, just going back to what you said, like enough, and the whole, like, carbs are bad. And luckily, you know, this, this young lady got help, and she's living a healthier life, you know, mentally physically. And there's definitely a lot of support and resources there, especially at a place like Stanford, but it's like, you know, the one thing that I said to my, my former student there was that, I think, in general, society looks at athletes, and they kind of see them as you know, like, robots, or just kind of like, they don't think about like, these are humans too, especially young athletes there who have can have these struggles and are susceptible to, you know, a lot of this misinformation and so yeah, again, I think it's so important. And I and I applaud you for being able to help people especially like you said, like, at a young age before they're, you know, you know, negatively influenced in that way.

Sheena Lawrick  1:17:04

Yeah, I should mention with the, you know, the teen rowers that we have worked with, like, we have always made sure that parents are on board, and that parents are a part of the cause because the kids aren't making their own food. And if, you know, for the for the most part, the parents have to, like also change some of their habits, whether it's what their how meals Yeah, exactly. And it we've been really lucky, the parents have always been like, Yo, I'm gonna do this stuff, too. I want to eat more vegetables and like, yep. So yeah, and it's, but it wouldn't be possible if we didn't have the parents support too. So. And yeah, we're just kind of, you know, we're very, very adamant about that when we work with, you know, anybody in the in the teens.

Bridget Moroney  1:17:46

Awesome. Um, well, what else? I know, we, I mean, it's, you know, we've, we've, we've talked a lot about, yeah, everything from behavior change to 75 hard. I don't know, as any anything else that kind of comes to mind or any burning.

Sheena Lawrick  1:18:07

But, you know, I think when we anytime we talked about identity statements, too, I think, like, one thing that, you know, that we like to mention to clients is, like, once they make an identity statement, like, that's something that can always be, it can always be changed, right, and they can always go back and adjust it if they need to. And that's, I think, part of like, the grace and patience and like, a lot of times, like, you know, life life, for as much as we don't want to react to it, it does happen, right. And so, circumstances change, and whether it's, you know, if something changes with your job, or you're relocating or things like that, like, your identity statement can constantly be in flux, right? Like, I remember, I, you know, before COVID hit, I had, I really, I loved my identity statement, I loved my life, I was like, I still love my life, but just I had it, it was very, like dialed in. And like, I was in a very, you know, a place where I could really focus on myself and I was, I was loving the, you know, seeing really good results in the gym, and our business was booming, and things like that. And, you know, and we started, we started a family, and then you know, getting pregnant and like, kind of seeing how my body changed and like how my identity statement just completely flipped, right to be no longer became about like, my, my identity statement had a lot of I, I, I. And then it became about, like, you know, you know, me as a mother, like, how I want to show up as a wife how I want to, you know, it became about, like, how do I support myself so that I can be the best version of myself force someone else too right. And so yeah, so like, I just think it's one of those things that like, it's a good habit to get into and just kind of constantly reevaluate where you are, what makes sense for you now, while also looking about how I want to be in the future, right, but it's just having the, you know, the ability to kind of just be like I said, Just Just be patient with yourself and not hold these unrealistic expectations or, you know, shoulds over yourself and really kind of being able to evaluate where you're where your ideas are coming from, or where your thoughts and beliefs about yourself are coming from, I think is super important.

Bridget Moroney  1:20:11

Yeah. I love that it's yeah, like you said, it's, it's, it's okay to change, it's okay to evolve and, you know, can go like the identity statement kind of like that that day 76 there like your identity statement, and can change because our because our lives change our circumstances change. And, you know, what, what's important? Maybe there's, there's still maybe a foundational aspect to there, but like you said, using your, yourself there, it's less, you know, in your case, it wasn't I was more we or, you know, us, and things like that, or the why behind it, it changes. So, not the

Sheena Lawrick  1:20:50

Values, values change, right? Like you, you might, you might value something differently now than you than you thought you were, whatever. So, yeah.

Bridget Moroney  1:20:58

Or, like, I like to use this as an example, you know, other values come up, like maybe, you know, health and fitness or whatever is still a value to you. But spending time with your children is now so that whole, like, I used to be able to work out two hours a day, every day at the gym, you know, because I value performance, health, fitness, whatever. Well, I still value that. But now it's maybe three days, you know, for 45 minutes, because now I have you know, something else that's a priority. A bigger priority there. So just like you said, having that set that grace there?

Sheena Lawrick  1:21:39

Perfectly said, yeah. 100% Yeah.

Bridget Moroney  1:21:43

Awesome. Well, this has been awesome. Really quick. So where can people I'll post it in the show notes, obviously. But I guess just verbally like, where can people find you if they want to learn more about you know, yourself your coaching?

Sheena Lawrick  1:22:00

Yeah, we're so we have a Yeah, our website is the best way to get in contact with us. We've got a contact form there. It's beyondtheboxnutrition.com. And then we're on social. We're on Instagram @beyondtheboxnutrition. You can find it here. And yeah, you can get a hold of us via email via our website, too. We're always happy to jump on phone calls with people up complimentary calls and like, honestly, you know, talk through some things make sure that's a good fit and all that good stuff. So yeah.

Bridget Moroney  1:22:29

Cool. Cool. And, and stay tuned for the what was it? The not so sexy diet challenge? In 2023 life long challenge. Yeah, exactly. Yeah. Awesome. Um, thank you so much, again, for being on here. Always a pleasure. Yeah, we'll see you next time. Sounds good. All right. That's all for today's show. Thank you so much, again, for listening. And be sure to head over to aspiretocoaching.com/podcast to check out the show notes for today's episode. There, you'll find some of the links we've mentioned on today's podcast, as well as some of the previous episodes we've done. And while you're there, please make sure you sign up for our show updates. I am always updating the show and bringing in bonus content. So you do not want to miss out on any of that. One last thing. If you loved this episode, and you think a friend would really enjoy it as well. Grab the link and share it out for me please. It truly does help spread the word of this podcast and the topics that we discussed on our episodes. And at the end of the day. My goal is to empower as many people on their performance journey as possible. Thank you all so much again, and we'll see you next time.