Amenha Arman  00:00

Is that we have I think societally become addicted to the process of processing, addicted to be therapy. You know what I mean? If you viewed therapy, the way you view personal training, you're not in it forever, you're in it to get out of it. You're in it to get the tools to get the self awareness and move on throughout your life. But there's become such an attachment to illness, right and not wellness. And that's what you're seeing online.

Bridget Moroney  00:38

Welcome to the performance RX podcast, the ultimate destination for anyone who wants to perform better in the gym and live a better life outside it. Whether you're just starting your journey, or you're a seasoned pro. This show covers a wide range of topics to help you reach your potential and live your best life. Each week on this podcast. I'll be bringing you expert interviews, personal stories, and actionable advice to inspire, educate and empower you to reach your goals. So hit follow. Grab your headphones and get ready to take your health and performance to the next level. Welcome to today's episode, how are you doing? Amenha?

Amenha Arman  01:16

Oh, I'm so happy to be here. I'm excited. I'm pumped. Thank you for asking.

Bridget Moroney  01:21

Yeah, absolutely. I am, I am super pumped to I think this is going to be a really, really interesting conversation. And even just before, this is why I had to press record so quickly, because as we were chatting, the ideas kind of kept flowing. And I'm like, wait a minute, we need to get we need to get this like recorded. So yeah. With that said, let's let's get to it. So really quick. Before we do dive into our conversation for today. I know I gave a little bit of a brief introduction with your background and biography for the episode. But was there anything else that you wanted to add to that? Or tell our listeners about yourself and your background?

Amenha Arman  01:58

Oh, my God, well, specifically for your listeners. I'll share this with them. So I was running. I was running earlier and just thinking about getting on this podcast. Like I wanted to stop so many times throughout my run. I know this is a small detail, but I'm like no, like you're about to be on Bridget's podcast. Like there's, there's like, you have a responsibility to finish this run lady. So, but that's just a brief thing. I'm a runner. And I oftentimes, you know, I've I have never shared that on a on a on a podcast. Sorry, I know I'm on a podcast. But ya know, I've never shared the fact that I'm a runner. Why is that? I've always like opened with the whole holistic therapists, you know, like, this is my background woman of color. But I yeah, this is the first the first podcast that I'm like comfortable saying, you know, I'm a runner. Yeah, that's what I do. So I'll open with that since you introduced my you know, the mental health stuff.

Bridget Moroney  03:00

That's awesome. And I love that you share that and thank you for sharing that not just with me and my listeners, but you know, in general there so you say you're a runner, like do you do marathons? five K's 10 k's are you Ultra athlete.

Amenha Arman  03:15

Thank you for asking. So I am okay, I'm really snobby about what type of races I sign up for. But I've stuck to my half marathons. It's just a right amount of endurance, right like perfect amount of under 13.1. Rough it's tough, but it's not 26.2 I still feel accomplished. But I'm not completely you know, dying at the finish line. So half marathons are my thing. Love them, love them. Hate them at the same time, but love them. Yeah.

Bridget Moroney  03:49

Nice. I've only done like one half marathon in my life, but I feel like that's a I guess Pandora's box that I would be willing to open again. Have you ever done a full full on marathon? Or?

Amenha Arman  04:01

Oh, God no, I have not. I haven't I've done I've done half marathons in a year. Like a few months apart. But I don't know I don't have it in me just yet. Like I don't have motivation or the spark of Ooh, I got to do a full one. I feel like the half is just enough and my knees you know, not complaining so far. So we'll see maybe maybe a full in the you know, in the cards for me, but for now we're sticking to half's

Bridget Moroney  04:30

yeah that's a good like I'm remembering my experience from my first and only half marathon and 10 mile like like you say like a lot of people maybe who don't realize like I guess I guess what I'm trying to say is often people look at marathons is like kind of the ultimate endurance challenge but to your point and I agree with with my own experience like a half marathon is not easy like and those lat and talking about like mindset and mental health and everything else like that like the last three miles of my half marathon it was it was all it was just it was it was tough physically but also also mentally.

Amenha Arman  05:11

Mm hmm. Yep. Endurance is real man. Oh, yeah, you get that with a half? Well,

Bridget Moroney  05:17

maybe I've been since I've moved to Colorado, I've been so inspired by like all these ultra trail runners, which of course are like, way more extreme. We're talking like hundreds, you know, of miles now. But, but maybe I'll realize maybe I won't let my ego talk me that far down the line. Maybe I'll start, maybe I'll start with a 5k. That's probably what I should do that first. I'll do my turkey trot. And then we'll see what happens from there. Part of

Amenha Arman  05:43

it is like, once you start like, I don't know if this is your experience, but from my experience, like once I start saying, Oh, I signed up for the turkey trot, or oh, I signed up for the 10k that's happening in you know, February, like what once the word gets out, there is some sort of motivation that you get from it just releasing that, you know, or that accountability that happens, like Yeah, that was

Bridget Moroney  06:09

literally what I was about to say is it's it's the accountability, it's putting there's, um, there's another coach and I guess you could say fitness influencer out there that I follow. His name is Cory Gregory. But that's always his piece of advice is have a date on the calendar, like so he's, he's into bodybuilding and powerlifting. So he either has a bodybuilding show, or powerlifting show or vacation or something. And like I said, his whole, his whole, I guess platform and brand is about aesthetics and some other stuff, but it's it's mostly aesthetics, because, of course, in our culture, the people, that's what that's what gets attention. But, um, but yeah, that's, that's what keeps it, there's a lot of things that keep him motivated. But that's one of the things is just having something to work towards there.

Amenha Arman  06:54

Yes, I'm 100% down for that. Yeah, definitely.

Bridget Moroney  06:59

I love I love this, this, this transition there have decided, and I'm glad I found this out about you about now that you're a runner, because I'm gonna, I'm gonna keep up with you and your, your running escapades. But by going back to, to your work, and in your field, in in mental health, so, you know, some of the ideas and conversations that we had and shared before this podcast was just kind of talking about how our two worlds in a way overlap in a lot of ways. And I think a lot of people would agree with this. But um, I guess we'll just kind of start with like, the client side. So as someone who is a therapist, you often see people who struggle with self esteem, maybe body image issues and things like that. And of course, and I agree with this, like doing the inner work is is so important for that. And I think kind of, I guess, springing off of that comment about our society being so driven by aesthetics, they see these transformations, right, like hashtag transformation, Tuesday, whatever, like these extreme transformations, that people who went from very overweight and unhealthy to seemingly at least physically healthy and fit and things like that. But and I've, and I've noticed this with some people that I that show these extreme Transformations is the mental health because then all of a sudden, if you don't do the inner work, there's just there's a lot of things that that can come up. And this is a conversation that I've also had with many other nutrition and health coaches is often I'll get clients or we'll get clients that come to us and say, I want to drop 30 pounds, and it's like, okay, I have magic wand, let's snap my fingers, you're 30 pounds lighter. Why is that important? What has changed in your life? And again, so going back to, I guess, kind of what I started to say, in this prompt here, as I'm wandering around, in my mind, people think that changing the outside is what's going to change the inside. And often it's it's reversed. So I guess just kind of opening that idea. I don't know if there was really even a question in there. But just an idea.

Amenha Arman  09:05

I love what you just said you need to go ahead and tweet that one changing that you say changing the outside for changing the outside to get to the inside. So,

Bridget Moroney  09:15

um, yeah, I think well, just like a lot of people, what they're really seeking at the end of the day, in my opinion are is confidence is you know, feeling purpose. And like we were saying, you know, just our little conversation about like accountability and motivation and things like that. They think that changing they're outside and looking a certain way it's going to change that for them. But often it's doing the inside work first.

09:38

Yeah. And I think I mean, I everything you just go completely second that and there's there has to be a way in which we come to acknowledge that both of our fields are in need of teaming up together. Like it's not just that you know, because so I see people through the hard work them through the trauma Through the darkness we're dealing with, right? And then simultaneously there is this sense of wanting to kind of, okay, so So it's almost like I've dealt with this stuff. Now I've dealt with the darkness, where's the confidence? Right? Like, that's an instant. Like, it's almost like they think you know how you mentioned that 30 pounds. A lot of clients think that since they've, you know, dealt with the hashtag healing and have done the child work, and, you know, because that's, it's been something that's popular, it's gained a lot. Oh, like, everyone's tagging their therapist or quoting their therapist, or, you know, it's kind of like, I'm the personal trainer, you know, like, it used to be very, an elite thing to have a personal trainer, right? Like, I have a personal trainer, nutritionist, I have a blah, blah. And now it's, I have a therapist, right? But with that sense of bragging that a lot of people do, and they don't know they're doing it. There's this entitlement, like now that now that we sat in the pain, why don't I feel like the best version of myself? And then and then that's when I go into Okay, so are we getting any movement? What's your diet looking like? What are we eating over there? You know, I mean, I'm not a nutritionist, right? But I mean, I eat healthy myself. And I know, you know what a healthy lifestyle looks like. But that's where you know, someone like you comes in and picks up some of that work.

Bridget Moroney  11:32

Yeah, I love that idea of, like you say, just basically working in tandem together, because and I've brought this up in other podcasts and those who are familiar with precision nutrition, that's one of their big teaching points is they call it deep health. And it's basically another way of saying holistic health or integrative health, it's not just the mental health, it's not just the nutrition, it's not just the movement, it's it's all of that together all of it integrated. But then there's also the societal, the social health, the existential health, the spiritual health, if you want to, you know, label it that way. It's all of it together. And so yeah, it's, as you just said, like, it's not just doing the inner child work and things like that. It's not just going to the gym, it's all of it has to come together. Well, this is like a little bit off our topic or whatever. But you mentioned inner child work and everyone tags, their therapists and social media. And I guess I just wanted to know your thoughts. Because I've heard this term. It's called like pop psychology, right? Because it is like every everyone's doing inner child work. Now everyone's And granted, listen, I grew up in less than ideal familial circumstances, but who hasn't? Who hasn't. And there's, I saw one psychologist or therapist was like, I liked their perspective. So I guess I'm just going to say, like, stop acting like a wounded person here. Like, I don't know, I feel like people take it a little bit too far. Yeah,

13:05

I. I mean, I see both sides, definitely. Because this is like, this is my bread and butter. But and I am also on social media. So I can completely hate, but is that we have I think societally become addicted to the process of processing, addicted to being in therapy, you know what I mean? If you viewed therapy, the way you view personal training, you're not in it forever, you're in it to get out of it. You're in it to get the tools to get the self awareness and move on throughout your life. But there's become such an attachment to illness, right, and not wellness. And that's what you're seeing online. And that's why I'm quoting, you know, Carl Jung, and like these existential poets and philosophers and all these, like, it goes back to that concept of you can become addicted to the illness, you can become addicted to that narrative, that story, you continue to tell yourself like your story, you just give me a brief, right, like if my familial, you know, situation wasn't the most ideal, right? That you? I don't know, much of I don't know about Mom, I don't know about that. I don't know about you. But it was just very brief, concise, right? That that may hint to the fact that you've done work or you're avoiding doing the work, right, but that's boring. Us and you get to decide who you share that shit with, right? It's like people just want to overshare and this goes back to the transformations man. Like, is that like, why do you feel the need to you know, to show each and every step of your process? Like what if a person who's Doing that isn't there yet, you know, they're gonna compare themselves. Right. And I'm sure that you, you see that all the time? Yeah, I wanted to go back to what you said, in terms of like, like holistic health or like a whole, you know, holistic sense of approach to help in general, like when you think of, you know, going to a salon or going to a barber shop, or whatever, like, you're, the people that you deal with on a daily basis, are doing more than just the act of serving you, right. So a personal trainer, or a nutritionist or therapist becomes a lot more other than just, you know, the service that they're providing you with. And I think that's where you know, it kind of, that's where the full circle happens, right. So like, if you're in the gym with someone, and they're telling you about the fight that they had with their partner, then you know, you're not just at the gym, you have now given them a therapy session. And same applies for me when I'm dealing with someone who's, you know, has low self esteem because of body image issues and all those that like, I'm like, Am I becoming a personal trainer and nutritionist right now? Or? No, that's

Bridget Moroney  16:20

a great point. There's so many people. And I think, as you just highlighted in the in, in many service industries and pathways there that basically we wear multiple hats. So again, kind of going back to that all that idea of just Yeah, working in tandem, really quick, a couple of things. I like, I actually loved what you said about the fact that therapy isn't supposed to be forever, because I again, I've had this conversation with with other coaches and nutritionists. And one of them said, it's the best breakup ever talking about her nutrition clients, like people shouldn't, and I guess kind of going back to like, being addicted to that illness or that, you know, that deficiency is you could say, but it's just like, we're here to empower people, you know, educate them, like you say, give them the tools to, to manage their, their health, whether it's mental health or physical health, emotional, spiritual, whatever. And yeah, I think that's maybe a misconception that people might have about therapy as well. It's like, again, you talked about, like, people, you know, perhaps avoiding doing the work there. They may have this misconception that like, oh, well, once I'm in therapy, that's it for the rest of your life. And that's not necessarily the case. Nor is that ideal.

Amenha Arman  17:40

Yeah, all of what you just said I'm like, snapping my fingers. But in terms of like empowering people, right, so like when you have a client that comes to you and says 30 pounds off, that's what I want and I want it done by my birthday or by my anniversary, but whatever it is, right people always have dates but they don't they're not viewing it as empowering themselves taking the 30 pounds off and like in same applies for what I see in session you know, I need to deal with with Mom Stuff I need to deal with that stuff like that's I need to deal with past traumas, my family's effed up all these things. It always goes back to you know a sense of resilience and who you you know, who you have become and where you are going and you know the road ahead and there's there's way more to it than just 30 pounds off right well

Bridget Moroney  18:35

and I think also like with with health or nutrition coaching like a lot of people think they're gonna get this quote unquote prescription of like eat this food in this amount and this is how it works and no and that's it's like that's for a lot of coaches myself included like we spend very little time actually looking at the food like of course we're gonna say eat more protein make sure like you mentioned you know, just you're eating healthfully there you're eating whole foods you're getting enough vegetables and things like that but again, it's like what are your habits like like that's that's the biggest thing that I think people and this again kind of ties a little bit into work and in the field of psychology but it's just the behavior that habits because guess what, I can give you a 21 day meal plan and I can say okay, if you eat this morning noon and night well first of all I cannot guarantee this because everyone this is one of my favorite quotes from the nutrition space but if everyone ate the same exact way none of us would look the same so I can give you a plan that I think is going to make you lose weight gain muscle whatever but can I guarantee you that no. But but the point I was gonna make a second ago is I can I can give you you know whatever 21 Day Shred but what happens when you have a bad day and your coping mechanisms aren't there and your your healthy coping mechanisms aren't there, and your usual coping coping mechanism is to emotionally eat or emotionally drink or say fuck the gym and stay at home. And again, there's nothing wrong with all of those things. But for people who are wanting to make long term change, like building that awareness and understanding that is what allows for that long term, again, that empowerment to live the life they want. Because the 30 pounds is easy. The 30 pounds is easy. I'm telling you, it's it's easy.

18:35

And part of an Yeah, I think what you're saying to like part of it, where my mind went is, I mean, through the behaviors, right, and the habits and all of these actions, that there are experiences that people have collected throughout their lifetime. Like, that's what you're seeing, and most of those back to it, like, at the end of the day, outside of the behaviors and habits that you do you know, who you are, you're not 30 pounds, you're not, you're, you're not the behavior. But if you don't have that sense of mindfulness, around your identity, and around your being, then that's what you're clinging, to, you're clinging to the oh, well, you know, I just resort to drinking, or I just resort to eating or I resort to baking or I do this right, you know, because that's how we tend to describe ourselves. But I think, I mean, from from the work that I've done, what I've seen is that it always goes back to identity and the sense of not knowing who's there, and you hear this and I'm sure you hear this in the gym, I hear it all the time. Like I found myself on the mat. I found myself through Pilates, I found myself through yoga, I found myself stomping on the pavement, like that's how I knew who I was. So a lot of emotional spiritual components, but very physical.

Bridget Moroney  21:55

There's so much to say. I guess I'll just, I'll just start with I that that last comment that you you brought up of the, the physical because this this is for me why I love training and exercise and and all of that, you know what I like I'm, I guess I identify as a strength athlete there, even though I do you know, I attempt to do things like running and things like that. But it's you learn as you just said, like, you learn about yourself through these, these physical practices, like, that's a metaphor for life. For me, one of my favorite quotes that I heard a long time ago, and I don't even it's so long that I don't even know where I heard it from. But I've said it many times to people when when the world is on your shoulders, do a back squat, because that's right, that is exactly love it. But again, it's like a metaphor for life, like lifting weights running, you know, 13.1 miles, these are intimidating things. Like you were just saying before, before this podcast, you wanted to give up and yet you didn't, you know, for whatever reason, you're showing up with integrity, and things like that. And And again, this is this is the, I guess the personal development side of of training and exercise and physical fitness that I learned a long time ago and keeps me coming back. Yeah, I forget what the other thing I was gonna say, Oh, the identity statements there. Yeah, going back to that, you know, and again, using our, our example of the person that wants to drop 30 pounds. And I've said this so many times as well, is that expectation that their identity is going to change once the 30 pounds is off, like, I'm the same person. And then the day that the scale says minus 30 pounds now I've changed and everything. Like, that's not how it works. And again, back to that process of changing the behaviors, changing the habits, but as you pointed out changing the identity. Because, yeah, I guess what if you're the person who always identifies as the emotional eater, and again, I'm not shaming anyone, but I'm just bringing up something that might potentially be an obstacle for people on their health and fitness journey.

24:20

Yeah, no, I want to I want to add to that, because oh my god, there's just there's we about to be here for a while. Okay, so ready? I think what? And like, tell me if this is an because this is just a beautiful intersection of what we both do together. So I'm really enjoying this, but in terms of like, okay, that person that lost 30 pounds, and then their mindset, their identities still in the but I'm an overeater, but I'm an overeater but mom would make me cookies after she would spank me, right. So there's that too, right? Like we're rewarded with food like we've been rewarded with for quite some time, right? And so they're there what happens is like there's a dissonance between what you see, right you see the skill, it says 30 pounds off, you should be happy and celebrating. But if that internal work, like you said, like that identity has not caught up to where you are now, then you're going to be in a space of confusion. And that transformation Tuesday, Thursday, whatever the fuck you want to call it, right? It's just a facade, you're giving us a facade, you're posing with these, you know, beautiful clothes that now fit you in a wonderful way. But on the inside, you're struggling. And it shows throughout your posts, maybe not your pictures, but it shows throughout your posts, and maybe your therapist hears about it, who knows. But it's definitely like, there has to be the mindset shift has to accompany the physical shift, or else, you're gonna have a sense of dissonance, and then the 30 pounds are gonna come back on, right? I mean, I don't usually

Bridget Moroney  26:03

hearing you say all of that makes me just think of like, the idea of destination happiness, I guess to put it simply, there is like, I'm going to be happy. When I lose this 30 pounds, when I get this job, when I marry this person, whatever it is, whatever it is, that's always the phrase, I mean, I'll admit, I've said this, in my, in my lifetime. I hope I don't say it as much or at all in this point in my life, but it's that phrase of, if I could only blank then Right?

Amenha Arman  26:31

And it's such a mirage, like it's a mirage, that's what you're chasing? If, if I when I lose the 30 pounds, then I will be happy, right? What about the gym, like what happens to your daily routine, did that not bring you in, or some happiness or joy or, you know, waking up in the morning, doing the meal preps, making sure that you, you know, like, you're in correspondence with your nutritionist or your coach or whoever it is that you're consulting with?

Bridget Moroney  26:59

And I guess, you know, we brought up the whole, like, the whole idea of, of identity and and behavior change. But I don't know if this is ever something that that you explore with your clients or not, but it ties back into making these changes for health. And something that I do a lot with clients is, is values. And I think that's in my opinion, I think that's part of the process of changing our behaviors and identity is identifying these things that are important to you. Because if you can sit there and say, Okay, I am someone who does value nourishing my body more than getting a quick dopamine hits from some cookies, it makes the behavior change differently. So, I don't know, that might I don't know if that is something that comes up or Oh,

Amenha Arman  27:47

for sure. Yeah. I mean, you have to identify your values, right? Like, and that the values work. A lot of it happens organically, like once people kind of go through that initial shock of oh my god, so I don't know who I am, right. I've never known who I was, wow, I've been saying I know who I am. But technically, the person I've been guarding has been described on my behalf for me by the outside culture and my family or whoever, you know, society right? Or everything I've been told I'm not and a lot of people just kind of run with that as an identity. So the values work happens you know, once that initial shock is like, Oh, I don't know who's inside this person. Okay, well let's construct them let's build it together let's build this person together this identity together and that's where the values work comes in. For sure. Yeah. And I can only imagine how powerful it is for your clients as well. Yeah, I

Bridget Moroney  28:47

was just thinking about that as you were saying that like society and especially bringing up women in fitness you look around our society and and even talking about our I guess our our our families and peers there you know especially I guess I'm thinking like families like people who are from older generations but the whole idea that a fit woman is very like small right like that's that's your that's your your road to fitness as a woman is toning and slimming down and and all this all this language here and and I guess kind of going into those identities and values like if you decide that yes, this is this is something that I value I do want to be whatever this then that's fine. There's no shame in that. But if you're someone and again, this is like maybe a whole other conversation but someone like me growing up as a young person socialized as female, but very much on you know, in the LGBT well not at the time LGBT community, but just kind of finding myself going through that quote unquote tomboy phase or whatever, like, I wanted to be tough, I wanted to be strong and, and there's always that that sense of shame or there was that sense of shame. And I think for so that's spot

Amenha Arman  30:10

on. I mean, yeah, the fit of fit woman has to be small, right? Dude, I cannot stress to you how much that resonates with me on a personal level, like forget my clinical work, whatever. But on a personal level, I grew up with five brothers. And I mean, I was a complete tomboy, I wanted to fit in and I wanted to, you know, kind of play in the dirt with them, whatever. But growing up everything that has ever been introduced to me about fitness was cardio, do not lift weights. You don't want to be bulky now do you? And that's that's like, that's, that is a an ingrained belief that I had to deconstruct flow very slowly, in order to get to a place where just now in my 30s Have I started lifting consistently, and that and that goes back to what the culture deems to be beautiful, right. It's a programming. And we were I mean, we're all a part of the program. Right? We're all raised, you know, we're all raised in this culture, regardless of where you are. Small, good. No muscles, because that's a boy thing. Yeah.

Bridget Moroney  31:30

Yeah, it's, um, I don't know. I Yeah. Again, like it's, it's one of those things, like, if you if you really feel like small is what you value, and you truly, you know, value that's fine. But as you're as you're bringing up like, a lot of women when they get into weightlifting and things, it's like, oh, wait, like, I can be strong, I can be capable. And you know, this fits in with with my values, but small

Amenha Arman  31:57

doesn't necessarily equate to like, you can be fat skinny. Yeah. Like small does thoroughly, you know, and I think that's part of it, too. I know, it sounds so simple, but like MOLLE doesn't necessarily mean that you are healthy, that you are strong that you are capable. And why would you be all over strong and capable? Right. But, again, it's a part of the system part of the program.

Bridget Moroney  32:23

Listen, I mean, if you want me to go on a whole rant about why I think every woman should like pick up a barbell I will, I will do it. But no, it's, it's true. Like it you know, again, and that's, I guess, this misconception around Fitness Through societal programming is, is yeah, the best way to lose weight is to do massive amounts of cardio, you know, and be smaller. And so a couple of things one, like they like you said, there's there's skinny fat there. So you burn off all this fat. And then what do you have underneath? There's there's really nothing there. Like, a lot of misconceptions. And again, it's like, it's that societal narrative, but like, what is beauty? Well, if you want to, like, muscle looks good on anyone. And as a woman, no, you're not going to get completely blown up like a man. Like, trust me. I've been lifting weights since I was 12 years old. I'm trying to get big. I'm not even close there yet. But I mean, but yeah, but by going back to like the whole idea of like, yeah, small bodies aren't necessarily healthy bodies. I mean, everything from just being strong. And when I mean by strong like, I'm not saying that you have to like deadlift 500 pounds, I'm just saying like, being able to carry your groceries up the stairs, or just just like everyday things that like, you should be able to do as as a human I was, I wish I I had like the exact statistic, but I saw something the other day it was on social media there and it was just talking it was like a voice clip or whatever a sound for reals or tick tock but it was talking about how a woman who falls after the age of 60 is it's basically the bottom line that they were trying to say is the likeliness of that being catastrophic either in you know permanently injuring them themselves or possibly death and I've known people in my life who've had their their mothers their grandmothers fall and that was it. Like it's it's insane. And then also just you look at things like osteoporosis and things like that. And so anyway, the the point of this like video clip there was just highlighting, like, lift the weights, build the muscle, like, again, like what I was about to say strong doesn't mean you have to be a power lifter pulling 500 pounds, it just means that you're able to live a very long and healthy life, hopefully long and healthy life. So

Amenha Arman  34:56

God yes, yeah. And that strength I have like, like you mentioned, like, it could be as simple as, like, do you want to carry your groceries in without being in a huff and puff, right? Like that strength bends? Just the gym, right?

Bridget Moroney  35:13

Any any challenge that were many challenges that I faced in my life there. Like, I always just think about like, well, if I can do this in the gym, then I can do this here like I have, I have the ability to persevere, just talking about exercise. And this is basically what we've been talking about, like it's the whole time. But using exercise as a form of therapy or mental health because you see this a lot, and I'll share I'll share a story with you. So like I said, I've been weightlifting, since I was 12 years old. Well, when I was 12 years old, I guess it started, but basically, I struggled with anxiety, I still deal with anxiety. But, um, but at 12 years old, it was it was a lot like talking about anxiety attacks, and just just kind of a rough time. Um, and so one of the things that my dad, so again, kind of going back to that socialist, I feel fortunate that I had a father who was non traditional in this sense, but one day, he took me to the gym, and he put a barbell on my hand and he said, do these curls. And basically, it was, and we just had a talk there about using exercise using strength training as a way to de stress for to just kind of put it simply there. And I know I'm not alone in this experience, because I know there's so many people again, kind of everyone tags each other on Instagram now but there's so many people that have posted about this like the gym not just being about the performance or the aesthetics, it is very much like a mental health refuge for so many so

Amenha Arman  37:01

go dad, I got goose Yeah. Oh, man, he you really pass some amazing life skills to you? Yeah. Yeah. But no, a I do agree with you. I mean, does like it's, it's way more than just just the gym for people to be honest with you, like, depending on you know, what it is they're working on? Or? Yeah, like, the, the what it is they're sharing. I mean, it's beyond the gains in the gym. Definitely.

Bridget Moroney  37:39

I was just thinking, so we've talked a lot about the benefits of, of therapy and working on your mental health and physical health and things like that. But, um, and I think it is, it is getting better in some ways, like we talked about in the beginning of this episode. It's becoming more mainstream, to be in therapy, and to have a therapist and things like that. But I still but there is just like anything, there's still a little bit of a stigma there. And, you know, again, like thinking about people on my side of the world who are maybe like, as great as it is to use the gym and exercise and treat your body right as as therapy, there is still sometimes a necessity to work with a professional like yourself. And one thing that I always bring up is that is the fact that like, if I if a person got injured if they fell down and broke their leg, they wouldn't think twice about going to the doctor or physical therapist. Right. And yet, there is still sometimes oftentimes that reluctance to go in and deal with the trauma, the anxiety, the depression, especially as someone who is presents themselves as this world class fitness person or athlete there.

Amenha Arman  38:58

Oh, wow. Yeah. Like are you was was the question like, how can we d stigmatize it or just make it a part of?

Bridget Moroney  39:06

Yeah, I guess I didn't really have a question. But yeah, I guess Yeah, your thoughts. But yeah, how can we d stigmatize it and exactly what you're about to say? Like, how could we make it more part of the norm of like, yeah, here's my massage therapist. Here's my physical therapist, here's my nutrition coach. And here's my psychological, you know, my therapist I'm working on my trauma with

Amenha Arman  39:27

I mean, there has to be like, I think that the dialogue is definitely out there. Now, like people again, are way more comfortable talking about it sharing, right? Because when I was growing up, I honestly I never heard someone say my therapist. Now you have 10 and 12 year olds, quoting their therapists, you know what I mean, and being okay with talking in class. And I think the biggest piece that may be missing is an alignment within the wellness field. I think there's a lot of competition going on between coaches, therapists and trainers or just you know, personal trainers or, you know, whatever it is that you, you know, people are kind of finicky with what they call themselves. But, um, but in terms of Yeah, like, what would it look like if there was a holistic approach, like, you know, because therapists have directories, right? There's like Psychology Today, there's therapy for black girls, there's therapy tribe. And so I think it would be beautiful. If there was a directory for, you know, or like a group of people who kind of centered their practice around. Okay, so here's the therapist, here's a nutritional coach, here's, you know, and so on and so forth. And I think, you know, tag teaming is a beautiful thing. Like, if you have connections to therapists or coaches or, you know, like, if there's a way to kind of just again, like, come together. Right, and, you know, benefit from each other. I think that would be beautiful.

Bridget Moroney  41:03

Yeah, I love the idea of Yeah, like you said, more, more collaboration. No, like, less competition. And just having, yeah, just just having that network of people that you can rely on. And then I and then I guess like, just to add to that, like, just from the the coach nutritionist personal trainer, like perspective, just being able to have that be willing and open to have that conversation with our clients like, hey, Bridget, I heard you, you know, you're you've been saying a lot of stuff, or I've noticing, you know, when you bring this up, you you kind of know withdrawn to yourself, shut down, whatever, whatever language you want to use, you know, maybe maybe you should maybe have Have you ever thought of talking to someone more about that. And you know, if you need anyone let me know i can i can definitely set you up with my friend Amina here. Your whatever it is, and just yeah, like, I guess kind of going back to like what you just said, like, having more collaboration there.

Amenha Arman  42:11

And also like not, I think there's a I don't know if you see this, but there's a fearfulness. Like, there's a sense of like, timid, when we want to introduce someone else into their, you know, into their wellness journey, right. So like, when a client talks to me about self esteem after having done the trauma work and unpacking a lot of stuff, I have to be, you know, open and honest, like, you want to talk to me about how many laps you're running. I'm not here for that. And you know, like, you might want to go get a coach for that, you know, what I mean? Might want to go talk to when attrition is about that. So I think we are timid. And again, I don't know if this is your experience. But I you know, from, from what I've heard, there's a sense of like shying away from having those potentially uncomfortable conversations. And they don't have to be uncomfortable. Just be honest about it. But yeah,

Bridget Moroney  43:08

I definitely agree. I think for a lot of people, those conversations can be uncomfortable there. And they don't have to be it's kind of openness, and I don't know, do I say Dare I say vulnerability on on each end

Amenha Arman  43:23

there. And you know, like that, kind of going back to the stigma and all that, you know, just what we were talking about a little bit earlier. It's like, you know, that saying that's floating around are like, but I see this all the time on Instagram, like perform, you can't outperform a bad diet, right? Like you can never outperform a bad diet and then they'll show a picture of what you ate on the weekend. And it's like this huge juice, or whatever. But I mean, the same applies for mental health. Like you can't outperform depression, you can't outperform trauma and anxiety, you just can't it's going to creep up in you know, in each and every crevice of your life and in your physical wellness. And yeah, it's gonna show up.

Bridget Moroney  44:09

That's that's a really good point because I'm just thinking again about people specifically those high performers in in this world here that are so driven and just kind of one track minded about their their sport, their goal, whatever. And again, it's just like well, I guess maybe it maybe it goes a little bit back to like what we were saying with the destination happiness or whatever, but it's just like, accomplish this focus on this. And yeah, again, you can't out you can't outperform you, you know, you can't, was it you can run but you can't hide like those things are like catch up to you. And in a big way. Um, Abby won back. Are you familiar with her? No. She Um, I went to school with her. She wearing my Yeah, my gait or blue and orange. Yeah. So she was, as I just kind of mentioned collegiate soccer player and then went on to play for the women's national team. And listen, I don't know her personally, or at least that personally, besides sharing the same alma mater and having some similar acquaintances, but long story short, after she retired from her professional career as a soccer player, she basically had this I guess you could call it identity crisis. But basically everything kind of came crashing down around her she had substance abuse issues, she her marriage to her wife ended, I want to say she had a DUI, basically, just so many things came just came crashing down around her because again, like you spend your whole life especially as someone like that, like, I would have to imagine she started playing soccer competitively at age six, right? In order to make it that far in the world of the world of sports like that, like you are you are trained and you're like odd that that path, you know, from a very, very young age. I say this because not that I was ever a professional soccer player, but I was in that world playing like weekend soccer and things like that. And I saw the girls and I knew the time commitment that was just your whole life again, just like soccer, soccer, soccer, soccer, and then you're like this elite, athlete. And again, there's so many people there's she's not the only one. But um, yeah, again, just like, you can't outperform, you can't outrun these things, these these, this depression, anxiety traumas, these addictions, whatever it is, or maybe they manifested addiction. And eventually she did. She got sober. And now she's, you know, she's on a better path. And she wrote a book, I guess, kind of around, like, that whole mindset there. But um, yeah, I don't think there was really a question. I guess I was just making me think of that.

Amenha Arman  47:05

I mean, the body yeah, your body carries all of your experiences, like, again, you can, you can get high, right? So at any given moment, and we see this throughout our, throughout our day, like just observe people at a coffee shop. They're rubbing their shoulders, they're massaging their knees, like we're constantly giving clues. As to what, right, I'm acting as if people can see me right now, because I'm moving around. But we're constantly clues as far as to what like where it is in your body. And if you're, you know, if you have a meditation practice or mindfulness practice, then yeah, you'll notice when things can't come up. And and I'm sure people, I'm sure you see this too, like, people will, will cry on the mat, or people will, you know, cry while they're lifting or, you know, get like, if you don't make that connection between, you know, body mind emotion. And you're just, here we are, we're just curling away. Right? Then it will eventually catch up to you, but it doesn't have to necessarily happen in the form of a, you know, an identity crisis.

Bridget Moroney  48:13

Yeah, no, I love I love that you brought up the whole, um, I guess, embodied wisdom, or just the things that we carry in our body. Like, I've, I've definitely been in yoga classes where the teacher and I have experienced this, like, are you? Do you practice yoga? Yes. Okay. So, so you might be familiar with this phenomenon in general, but specifically the move of pigeon pose. And yeah, so I don't know if if this is, like I said, something that you've experienced or that you knew about or but I've had yoga teachers bring that up, like, Okay, we're gonna get into pigeon and pigeon is a very can be a very intense but first of all, it's intense. Physically, like, it's, it's, you know, for those who are unfamiliar, you're stretching your hips and your glutes, and, you know, we just we carry a lot of tension there but there's also a lot of emotional tension there. And so I'll admit like, I have had and this is like during this was during some, I guess, tumultuous time so my mother was was sick and dying at the time but definitely broke like you said broke down on the mat crying during this or I had a friend translate that I have a friend he used to be a massage therapist. He's still my friend Hynek. But, but he was a massage therapist at the time and he brought up he would be working on clients and he he's, you know, same thing like work on a certain area and would release whatever that trauma was. And he would have people crying on on the on the on the table there or this was an interesting one. I guess he was a massaging someone's neck and the person started laughing. And they were laughing What the, what had happened was the injury was they had given themselves whiplash from head banging, because they were laughing so hard. So it's just, it's all that to say, like, just very interesting. Like, again, like what you said, like what our bodies carry with us, or for us.

Amenha Arman  50:26

The thing is, it's not like we're completely out of sync with that with our bodies. Right? Like, there are, there are clues in each and every ache that you are receiving, you know what I mean? And, you know, I'm sure as a coach, this like, it's, I mean, you see it in bad form. Right? Like a person walk in and you can you you see why they feel misaligned because they are, do it, you know, they have bad form. Um, but yeah, it's it's, I don't Yeah, it's never just it's never just an ache. There's, there's, there's a lot more there.

Bridget Moroney  51:10

Do you ever? I don't know if I can ask this. But and if I can't ask it, then we can just skip. But do you ever? Do you ever do like embodiment practices? Or do you work with clients and that kind of way there or guide them along?

Amenha Arman  51:28

Yeah. So I yeah, I'm more so guide them along. Most of my sessions are through zoom. And, yeah, so like, it depends on the client, and what you know where I am within their journey. But for the most part, like the trauma work that I do, is really body centered. So it's, you know, it's called Narrative exposure therapy. And what you do is you collect the story, the narrative, right of the traumatic experience, the therapist collects the story. And there's a dialogue between the therapist, and you know, the way your body's presenting itself, to the therapist. And so yes, you're talking, you're telling me about the event, but a lot of the times, you know, we we block out these negative events, these traumatic events. And so when you are stuck in you can't remember something. That's when I come in, and I asked you questions about what's coming up in your body, I see that you shifted, where are you sensing it moving? Now, you know, because that trauma is kind of it just continues to move throughout session. So that's some payment work that I do.

Bridget Moroney  52:42

Just talking. So again, talking about things that have become popular and more mainstream. In both of our worlds is, is the whole, like, mindset training, and mental, you know, mental performance training and visioning and things like that. And again, you see this with like, elite athletes, like, I'm pretty sure there's I would probably overgeneralizing, but probably not when I say that every professional sports team out there has a sports psychologist to deal not just with, you know, not just what we mentioned, the you know, the depression, anxiety and trauma of things, but also just with the winning mentality because again, it's it's literally their job as professional athletes to to win. And, and, you know, just like any of us, they're human beings, they have limiting mindsets, they have limiting beliefs and things that

Amenha Arman  53:42

I think we obviously we need mindset training, right, because we we all have our own, you know, devices and ways that we self sabotage and doubts and fears. And, you know, I think it's a beautiful tool to have, right? But we also have terms with like, there's a process to you know, experiencing life stuff sometimes. Put simply, like, you have to just be in the process. It's, there's, there's nothing that you can, you know, you can't train yourself out of that, like this is a complete life change. This is a life transition. And you have to deal with it as such. And, you know, affirmations and positive speaking and envisioning and the vision boards and all that I am all for it, really I am but I'm also for being authentic to like, your experience and what's happening for you in the hearing now.

Bridget Moroney  54:42

I like that I that's that's a good point to bring up like yeah, I'm all about the mindset training to and it's it's fun, and it's it feels good, and it's exciting. But yeah, I think again, just like you can't outperform trauma just like you can't out exercise a bad diet. You Can't out mindset just shit happening in life. And I think well for all of us, like, from the Tom Brady's of the world to no mere mortals, like, like myself here, like, life happens, and it's going to happen at inopportune times. And I think you said it perfectly. They're like, you just have to go through the process like, um, yeah, I mean, COVID was a was a great, you know, as in a widespread example of that, like, you know, we can't, there's, there's there's a lot in this in this world in this life that we can't control. And you just have to go through it.

Amenha Arman  55:41

Oh, yeah. Yeah, yeah. And not to say that the mindset training isn't going to be helpful. It will be helpful, right, whatever mindset training you in the past, before you had to deal with this extreme life change may be helpful.

Bridget Moroney  55:59

Yeah, well, I actually think that's a great points again, like, what I was saying before, what we were saying before, like, the work you put in at the gym, carries over into the other parts of your life. Like, I guess that's kind of like, a good way to kind of highlight this whole episode here is I get it all. It all builds on each on itself, right? The the mental health work, the physical health work, the nutrition, and it doesn't mean that your life is going to be perfect. Like you can't hack your way out of whatever things that happen. Whether it's in your personal life, your professional life, your actual physical health, whatever, but you can, you can set yourself up for better, I guess, success, or just a better way to get through it. If you're physically resilient if you're mentally resilient and things like that.

Amenha Arman  56:51

Yes, yes, yes. Yes. Like once you start taking those first steps, right. So like, I've seen clients, right through mental health distress, right. And then I've seen them join gyms, start lifting, go through a divorce. Right? Because of these, you know, because of the first step of therapy than joining a gym, then feeling strength, right, just from lifting, right, just kind of breaking it down to a simple. Here are the steps. And I mean, just complete life transformation, just from those tiny steps, right? Just first step, get a therapist. Second step, let me join a gym. Third step, let me start lifting, Oh, I feel strong. When I feel strong, I can make you know, life choices and make decisions for myself. That may have in the past. felt impossible. But I don't see them as impossible any longer. Because I'm recognizing my own strength and my own capabilities. And yeah, so on and so forth.

Bridget Moroney  58:02

I have a you said to bring up any curiosity. So since we were talking a little bit about that. Well, let me just say that so something that that's gotten really popular over the past couple of years is cold therapy.

Amenha Arman  58:14

You mean like getting a cold bath like ice bath or? Yeah,

Bridget Moroney  58:18

yeah, like everyone, everyone's got an ice barrel now and they fill it up and they get in there and they sit there and they breathe and I think listen, I think that's awesome. Um, for well, one, I've used Cold Therapy just for physical therapy like it'll get the aches and pains out but as I've gotten deeper and deeper down the rabbit hole and I think Wim Hof has really popular like pop yeah popular Bueller rised it for the mental health aspects of it yeah

Amenha Arman  59:08

and I will say just on a personal note, I have experimented with the cold showers they suck in the moment right and eventually you get used to it Yes. But I mean I have seen and you know read a lot of research on like how it aids and anxiety and depression and so I I second that but I can't say that I've done it consistently to drastic change but will it wake me up? Oh, it will wake me.

Bridget Moroney  59:44

Yeah, same. I haven't gone that far down the rabbit hole of self experimentation like I do have done like the cold showers which cold shower in Colorado is way different than cold shower in Florida. So I first started doing like when I first came across this I was still living in Florida and I put on culture. I was like, this is nothing and I got to Colorado. I was like, holy shit. Um, but yeah, but saying like, Yeah, feels good I, you know, I feel supercharged wakes me up makes me feel like a little more resilient. Like speaking about the cold air I step out of the shower and I'm just like, Oh, I feel good now. Like, there's that mental aspect of it. Like I, you know, stood here for one minute like I can I can, you know, the rest of my day doesn't seem so difficult or whatever this thing that came up that stresses me out doesn't seem um, but yeah, I was. Yeah, I guess going back to like what you were saying like with the research and everything. I was curious about that. Because I've seen a lot of people just off the cuff mention it. And I know there's there's one coach out there that she'll work with people or she's had clients who I guess, use it as part of their therapy for addiction, which I'm, I'm assuming probably just I don't know, I don't want to dismiss it completely. But I feel like it's nothing, nothing kind of works by itself. And I guess what I mean by that is, you're sitting in a cold bath. And what you're supposed to do is you're supposed to breathe and relax and activate your parasympathetic parasympathetic nervous system. And so again, I don't know enough about this. And so I might be completely ignorant, but it seems like from what I know of it, and what I can see, it's like, that's helping with the addiction and in the anxiety and depression, but maybe not. Maybe it's maybe it's all of it there. I just, yeah, it's interesting.

Amenha Arman  1:01:29

Yeah, no, I completely second that, like, I agree with you in terms of like, what we see what people are posting. And then like, peoples are like coaches like areas of specialties, there are people who kind of get trained in the Wim Hof Method, right, then they just kind of, that's their victory. And there's, there's a lot of research that supports it, I don't know that I would recommend someone do that, as you know, as now, the magic pill, it's definitely not a magic pill, there is no magic. But it definitely will get you out of your head. Because you're, you know, you're activated in that way. But in terms of like, you know, anxiety, or panic attacks, I know that, you know, they, they say like the, you know, activate the five senses. And oftentimes like for, you know, kids and stuff, they'll say, like, get an ice cube and just have the have, have the child either play with it or, you know, rub it on their face or yeah, just kind of feel that cold sense.

Bridget Moroney  1:02:40

Is there anything else? I mean, like I said, we've, we've had quite the conversation here.

Amenha Arman  1:02:47

Yeah, I have one more thing. This is just kind of, yeah. Because I don't want to sound dark and dreary, right. Like, here are all the problems that come up when you don't deal with your shit. No. I think, okay, so if you don't have a therapist, and, you know, you want to go the self help route, right, because I support that too. And you you find yourself in the gym, you have a coach, or you know, you're kind of just focused on the physical, right? Notice when things do come up for you. Like we mentioned, drying on the mat, we mentioned, you know, releasing while you're lifting like all those things. So notice, find yourself in an emotional space. Curious about that. And if you're committed to, you know, a holistic sense of wellness, then you'll pay attention to, you know, some of the some of the work that's calling. Because, again, your body's giving you clues, and the clues are in you know, some of the stuff that comes up when you are physical.

Bridget Moroney  1:04:03

I love that. I think that's that's great advice. There are great message like totally second that. Again, it's like yeah, just having that curiosity and I think people who really do go on that that wellness journey, like that's what allows them to explore different different modalities of wellness of healing, you know, maybe it starts off like you said with just going to the gym and then maybe they get curious about their nutrition. Maybe they noticed certain things come up emotionally, maybe I should talk to somebody. Yeah, I love it. I love it.

Amenha Arman  1:04:40

And instead of thinking like, come up with a movement, maybe we can make this cool. I don't know. But like if there's a way to like remove the the number and the pounds, right like I want X amount of numbers x amount of pounds off, right? What would it be? Was like There's a behavior that I want to change. There are some habits that I'm not really feeling. And that's my focus. Can you help me? Well, like if we change that dialogue, you know, like, I just don't know. But that would be beautiful.

Bridget Moroney  1:05:15

I will continue to try and change that dial. I think, you know, I think whatever gets you in the door is great there. But yeah, just having that dialogue as a, as a trainer as a coach as a nutritionist. We're so much more than numbers. Right? Like, you're I, I had this conversation with with someone else. And I thought she says so. Right. Like, my weight is the least interesting thing about me. There. Maybe they maybe that's the way to make it cool. In the in the dialog is like, yeah, there's so many other interesting things that will come up for you, on your wellness on your healing journey, whatever it may be, then just a number on a scale or a number on a bar, whatever it is, definitely. Oh, well, I love it. Um, I think that was a really great call to action. Thank you so much for for sharing all of that. I mean, I'm really quick before before we do, and today, I want to put it out there. So for people who are interested in more of what you have to say, and your content, or maybe people that would like to work with you. Where can where they can. Where can they find you? Where's their so hard today? Oh,

Amenha Arman  1:06:29

well, thank you for inviting me. This was I loved it. This was so enjoyable. It's a great way to start my Monday. So thank you, I appreciate it. They can find me at sane in the membrane.com is the site. So if you have any curiosities about the type of work I do, or what it looks like to work with me, the answers are there. And then Instagram and Tiktok is seen in the membrane. But it's separated, separated, separated with dots. And I don't know why Instagram made me freakin do that same.in dot the duck membrane like why they took it away from me. So but yeah. On social media, I have a lot of fun with the reels and the tiktoks And yeah, short therapy, therapy, shortcuts and stuff like that.

Bridget Moroney  1:07:19

I was gonna say I love your, your reels and your tiktoks They're the one that I've been quoting or bringing up quite a bit in my, in my household or talking to my wife recently is I don't know when you posted it, but I saw it like a couple of weeks ago was about the fireflies.

Amenha Arman  1:07:39

Oh, well. What did I say about Firefly?

Bridget Moroney  1:07:44

It was so I loved it because this is i It resonated with me as someone who can be overly empathetic. But you said something to the effect of like, What would our What would our summer nights look like? If all of the Fireflies or some of the Fireflies dimmed their their lights? Because there were others who were struggling and basically kind of went on to explain that like, yeah, imagine there was a firefly that was having a bad day and some some other Firefly, just like started to feel guilty and it's like, oh, maybe I shouldn't shine as brightly for you know, because and again, again, like kind of the metaphor for life because there because again, like as someone who maybe feels that, well I say empathy, but you know, it turns into that guilt of like, oh, you know, your you know, I guess maybe I feel bad for being so joyful today. Whatever. It's yeah, I liked it a lot. So yeah, definitely some good nuggets of wisdom out there.

Amenha Arman  1:08:48

I'll take it. I forgot about the Firefly one. Thank you. I appreciate it.

Bridget Moroney  1:08:52

Yeah, absolutely. I'm awesome. Well, yes. Yeah, please go check out Amina Yeah. And by the way, I love love those handles to seen in the membrane this throwback to some old school 90s out there. Yes. Which I got Amina and st are seen in the membrane.com thing. Yes, yes. Yes. Keep your sanity. Um, yeah, this was a really fun conversation. Once again, thank you so much for being on here. And yeah, we'll see you next time. Okay, man. Yeah. Hey, really quick before you go, I need you to do one thing for me. If there was something in this episode that you think would be a value to someone else, please share it for me. My goal is to empower as many people as possible on their health and fitness journeys and one of the best ways to do it is to share awesome information like what you heard in today's episode out with many others, so do me a favor, copy and paste that link. Send it to one of your friends, your family or Anyone who you think would get some enjoyment and value out of this I appreciate you for listening I'll see you next time